Andy Murray will be aiming for a place in the Queen’s Club semifinals when he takes the court against Gilles Muller on Friday. John Isner and Viktor Troicki are also part of the quarterfinal schedule.
(1) Andy Murray vs. Gilles Muller
Murray and Muller will be squaring off for the fourth time in their careers and for the second time this season when they clash in the quarterfinals of the AEGON Championships on Friday. The head-to-head series stands at 3-0 in favor of Murray, who most recently defeated Muller 6-4, 7-5 on the hard courts of Dubai earlier this year. This is their first-ever meeting on grass, as the Scot also prevailed on hard courts in 2011 (Davis Cup) and 2012 (Brisbane).
Muller has a British coach in Jamie Delgado, which may be a reason why gets along well with Murray and should be comfortable playing in London. The 48th-ranked Luxembourgian’s week is clearly off to a stellar start thanks to victories over Mikhail Youzhny (in a third-set tiebreaker) and Grigor Dimitrov. Murray has improved to 38-6 for his 2015 campaign after taking out Yen-Hsun Lu and Fernando Verdasco in straight sets earlier this week. The third-ranked Scot is 17-1 in his last 18 matches and 22-5 lifetime at Queen’s Club with three titles (2009, 2011, and 2013). One of the best returners in the game, Murray is a very difficult matchup for the big-serving Muller–even on grass.
Pick: Murray in 2 with no tiebreakers
[polldaddy poll=8938983]
Viktor Troicki vs. John Isner
Although Thursday’s outcome of the Isner vs. Feliciano Lopez match may have been a slight surprise given the surface, the scoreline could not have been more expected. There were no breaks of serve and it ended 7-6(5), 6-7(9), 7-6(4) in favor of Isner, who out-aced Lopez 36-29. The 6’10” American had kicked off his week with a 7-6(11), 6-4 victory over countryman Jared Donaldson. Despite a disastrous first two months of the season, Isner now owns a respectable 21-13 record and is in contention for a top 16 seed at Wimbledon.
Up next for the world No. 18 is a sixth career showdown against Troicki. Isner still trails the head-to-head series 3-2 after getting the job done 7-6(4), 7-6(5) this spring on the clay courts of Monte-Carlo. Troicki is 3-1 at his opponent’s expense on hard courts and they have never faced each other on grass. Speaking of the slick stuff, Troicki’s Wimbledon preparation is off to a borderline ideal start. The 25th-ranked Serb finished runner-up to Rafael Nadal last week in Stuttgart and so far at Queen’s Club he has fought past Paul-Henri Mathieu and Marin Cilic–both in three sets. Troicki is no stranger to going up against the Isner serve and he will benefit from those experiences in addition to his minor surface advantage.
Pick: Troicki in 3
[polldaddy poll=8938981]
Think I would have been a big Laver fan. Don’t know for sure but am thinking perhaps he didn’t have the arrogance of Federer (and perhaps not the same fandom religious following).
Some relatively good highlight footage a year before he retired against Connors in 1975. Laver is 36. Connors just 22.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SptdffCeVmM
31 seconds between serves at the 4:30 mark and no time violation warning to Connors.
So much for the fedbots that claim the game was played quickly by all back in the day.
#ShhhRevisionismAtWork
haha….that’s a pretty sharp observation hawkeye! well done
Yeah I was watching it. Very impressed especially given he was playing with a wood racquet.
But then I noticed how long they were analysing the play between points and there was a clock on the video feed so it was easy to time.
I WAS a Laver fan! I grew up watching him.
I have been telling the Fedbots too many times that the game was not played fast in previous eras. I know because I was there and I saw it for myself!
I also remember seeing a youtube video of a young Borg playing a Laver past his prime in some tournament somewhere. Borg beat him in straight sets and even watching it so many years later, it was quite something to see this young teenage phenom beating the great Laver.
Except, neither Connors nor Mac were known for sportsmanship in their day. They were, I would say, slightly more honest versions of Nadal and Djokovic today, in the sense that they made no bones about playing fair on the court by spouting “humble” platitudes during the interviews. There was no pretense of fair play. They both wasted time on court with their endless banter. I think Connors was still a little subdued in this match because of who he was playing. Just like Mac versus Borg, where Mac went out of his way to be relatively calm out of respect for the man and the talent that Borg was. Today’s players lack even that sense of dignity on court and consistently at that. So yes, the so called “Fedbots” are 100% right when they call out Nadal/Djokovic. And I think the fans of these players know it. For me personally, I would still respect these two if they didn’t stage the sort of pretenses they stage in their interviews.
There were always guys who respected the game less than some of their counterparts. But even in that, there was at least some level of dignity because they didn’t hide behind a facade of humility. Laver himself has come out and said that he’s amazed at the time players seem to regularly take between points and all the towelling-off that goes on after every point. It’s so ridiculous. How do these guys hit an ace and then ask for a towel?That’s the reason in my opinion, that out of the current lot, Laver seems to respect Roger the most.
And he was just 5′ 8″.
@Oxc, Djokovic forcefully changed himself to become one of the ‘good guys’ and he wanted to fedal . Nadal, on the other hand, has been always like that since his teenage years! He is the most humble athlete you are ever going to see. If someone thinks that his false modesty, he does not know rafa at all! he/she is in a delusion 🙂 It all comes so naturally to rafa! He is a guy who is known to feel a little embarrassed about driving his Astin Martin in the small town of Mollorca where people don’t own many luxury cars !
He is a guy who has never thrown a racket on court ever since he started playing tournaments at age 10!! Because he has been taught to respect the equipment . His values are such that he believes it is not the fault of the racket and that he is fortunate to be in a position where he is! So you don’t seem to know rafa at all..superficially knowing him to reach these conclusions is not uncommon though.
I read some of your posts and I appreciate your tennis knowledge! Your viewpoints are mature I think. I am glad to see a federer fan posting here and a fan who knows some good stuff.
Regarding federer, well, he is the arrogant one while rafa is the humble one. Federer TRIES to play all humble and diplomatic but you cannot fake anything with perfection so we often see some federer gems in interviews and on court. Rafa , well, has always been like rafa of today ! Nothing about him has changed. His humility is one for the ages.
Both are two of the greatest of all time but possess very different personalities.
Regarding taking time between points, well, I am not going to say that rafa is totally right in taking more time than allowed . It is a rule (with many loopholes though) so implementation will obviously be there. But, the way federer fans try to paint it given their anti-nadalism, is also not too reasonable.
If you can be neutral for a moment (I know it is tough for us fans to be that haha), try to think from rafa’s perspective. He had certain ‘habits’ and ‘rituals’ developed as a CHILD and to deal with anxiety, he carried them forward because it was kind of part of the ‘package’ . I don’t think rafa ever had the intentions of using these rituals to cause harm to his opponents! There was NO such rule as well so he was never trained to play under the time constraints of today! The wins grand slams, becomes a giant of the sport and THEN you ask him to suddenly change his playing routine! That’s harsh on the guy. He has tried hard to eliminate some rituals (sock pulling , not handing over two towels to ball kids before a game begins for e.g) and he has picked up the pace a little but when you have something SO firmly embedded in your routine , it is very tough! Federer and some others are lucky they were trained in a different way and they never developed any such rituals.
Toni nadal has often voiced that rafa wants to get rid of his rituals and he (toni) tells him to get rid of them . I understand why some players and their fans can get frustrated but to expect that everything will go away suddenly because of an unprecedented rule, is also unreasonable!
Perhaps NNY can better comment on Connors and Laver because she has seen them all live! Wish I had that experience ..haha
natashao and vamosrafa,
Yes, you both seem to have figured it out. I thought about it a bit more and am in complete agreement with you both! 🙂
I am sure others are intelligent enough to figure it out 😉
Those were the FH Rafa that caused havoc and damage. Rafa FH-where art thou now? You are sorely missed. Just see some of those FH winners..Jesus.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=plGC4-9FmmA
Oxc,
I have to take issue with some of your revisionist history regarding players like Connors and McEnroe. Calling them honest is not accurate at all. Their gamesmanship on the court was quite dreadful and self-indulgent. Their tennis when they played each other was sublime at times and worth watching, but I despised their antics on court.
I have tried to make the point to Fed fans who seem to think that Rafa invented taking longer to serve, that he is hardly the first to do it. There has been all kinds of gamesmanship in this sport over the decades and for Fed fans to single out Rafa, is disingenuous at best.
There was nothing honest about the crap that Connors and McEnroe engaged in on the court. It was utter nonsense. How about Lendl? You want to talk about enmity between players? It was well known that Lendl and McEnroe despised each other. Lendl was likely to try to deliberately hit at his opponents as an intimidation tactic. Something you do not see anymore in the game today, thank goodness.
The Fedbots are wrong when they call out Novak or Rafa for what they perceive to be a lack of honesty and/or fake humility or whatever. They are far more likely to go after Rafa, as a matter of fact. Rafa and Novak have had their issues and have not pretended otherwise. When Rafa accidentally hit Novak with a shot in his face at the 2013 Cincy semi, Novak was very upset and would not accept Rafa’s on court apology. But they worked it out later on. So what is this business about them being dishonest?
Oh, and with respect to Laver complaining about the amount of time players take today, maybe he should be reminded that the sport is not the same as it was in his day. The athleticism and physicality of the game today makes the tennis back in his day look like Ping-Pong. New rackets with high technology have also given players more power. I loved Laver but in this regard he is simply not acknowledging the reality of this sport today.
I wanted to make one more point. Ilie Nastase, anyone? His antics on the court are the reason that the code of conduct was established in the first place. I remember a match at the USO in which he played McEnroe and where he basically refused to continue playing when the chair umpire made a call he didn’t like. I remember the crowd throwing food on the court and booing long and loud. I don’t remember all the details. I did watch it a while back on a youtube video. All I know is that at some point, Nastase agreed to play on. Delaying matches and gamesmanship was a mild word for what he did on the court. So was he honest? The guy made a colossal joke of himself, even though he was very talented.
You are saying that bad behavior on the court and publicly hating and disrespecting your opponent, is honesty. Nothing could be further from the truth!
Wow, that was great for knowledge! thanks a lot NNY ! I have only read about these greats but you have seen them all so these posts were awesome to read,
Rafa is rafa, look at how BRUTALLY honest he has been in 2015!! it is sooo good that it almost seems fake! but there lies the difference! it is all genuine because it is Rafael Nadal !
Djokovic was quite immature early in his career but he had evolved wonderfully well and now he is very mature. His sportsmanship is quite admirable.
“I remember a match at the USO in which he played McEnroe and where he basically refused to continue playing when the chair umpire made a call he didn’t like. I remember the crowd throwing food on the court and booing long and loud.”
If this is what is being referred to as ‘honesty’, then God, we don’t want this type of honesty! LOL
Classic.
Read what I wrote. There is no doubt that guys like Mac, Connors, Nastase were among the biggest when using gamesmanship in their day. Only, they did not pretend to be fair. They were open about playing and winning dirty. Today’s guys are more discreet about pulling the same tricks these guys did. They display lack of fair play too, only they do it quietly by either being extremely slow between points or by taking shady MTOs or simply pretending an injury (the way Djokovic does). Not throwing around a racquet on occasion is not a sign of ‘fair play’ (@vamosrafa) It might be good manners but there is a distinct difference between the two. Time wasting is always done to make the other guy think more and react less instinctively, particularly on important points, than he otherwise would. Racquet throwing on occasion may point to a mercurial temper. It doesn’t do much else. The same problem is with grunting. When you grunt at a time when the racquet makes an impact with the ball, it becomes just a tad harder to hear and consequently, anticipate the ball on the other side.
I really don’t care what players say in the pressers when it comes to judging humility. They’re a formality that some are better at dealing with than others, particularly after a tough loss. I’m more interested in how they play the game and judging players by what I see on court. And I don’t like watching contradictions on court.
OxC says:
June 26, 2015 at 3:13 am,
—by taking shady MTOs…—
=======================================
.
Taking a shady MTO:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BrJLVtrCQAEqvIS.jpg
hawkeye,
Yes, thanks for point out that Laver was not tall. But he made up for it with his tremendous game. He was like no one else ever in the game. My idol growing up. Also, a true gentleman, quite humble. Gee, that reminds me of someone! Rafa! 🙂
Only, Laver prefers Fed over Nadal. Guess he’s a better judge of character, no? 🙂
No.
Federer’s game is a closer style to Laver’s so it is not surprising.
Am thinking Laver was not as arrogant. (What player is?) 🙂
Yes.
It was Federer who he asked to write the foreward of his autobiography. An honour literally ANY player would’ve loved to have had. So it’s definitely more than stylistic preference.
Federer’s arrogance or the lack of it is a matter of opinion. Laver clearly has no problem with who Federer is. In fact, no player, active or retired has paid Laver the kind of tribute Roger has. His speech at AO ’06 is by far the most sincere burst of emotion I’ve seen on a tennis court in a really long time.
OxC says:
June 26, 2015 at 12:54 pm,
—In fact, no player, active or retired has paid Laver the kind of tribute Roger has.—
=======================================
.
In fact, Rafa thinks that Laver is the GOAT.
Interview with Rafa in Basel on October 19,
Tages-Anzeiger, October 20, 2014 [in German language]: ¤¤ Roger and I get along, but we are not friends.¤¤
[An excerpt translated by Chris Boardman]
Question: “Do you follow the debate as to who the greatest tennis player is? You, Federer or someone from the past? What is your view?”
RAFA: “It is difficult to speculate as long as our careers are not yet completed. But in my opinion there much evidence that Rod Laver is the best in history. He won the calendar Grand Slam, joined the pros and won the Grand Slam again after a long break. That’s great. If he had not turned pro, he would certainly have won more majors than me and probably more than Roger as well. Laver must definitely be considered in this discussion. Roger has the most Grand Slams titles and broken many records, he is certainly one of them.”
thing about twinge… he had bite
maybe twinge bumped his head.
like really, really, REALLY hard
Twinge was an undiluted Muzz fan; definitely not a Rafan. There are people basting they know who it is but won’t say because they haven’t got a clue. They are just bluffing. If you know, why not give us the benefit of your wisdom?
It could be Cheryl Murray, 🙂 she was a Rafan.
why are you getting so defensive about the identity of a poster who has ‘recently’ joined LOL ..too funny
It took me a while but never thought she’d stoop so low.
Hilarious!!!
nadline,
You make these insinuating posts which are really attacks directed at me. But you won’t address me by name. Typical of you. Do not tell me or anyone else about not having a clue!
As a matter of fact, it was ed who asked me if I would share my thoughts. I declined. So it’s really none of your business.
This poster pretends to be new to this site, having supposedly been “reading” this site for a while. Then she comes and conveniently does your dirty work for you by going after the very people who you attack and insult on a regular basis. A bit too familiar, huh?
Oh and just to clarify, I never said definitively that I thought it was someone from TT. All this person does is repeat what you and augusta say, so I don’t know that it’s someone from TT at all.
nativenewyorker7 says:
June 26, 2015 at 1:54 pm,
—All this person does is repeat what you and augusta say…—
=========================
.
What??? She has commented on YOUR posts!
It’s not twinge. He was quite intelligent and had a wicked, quick wit. I do not recall anyone on TT who ever took sides with some Rafa fans against other Rafa fans. Not that I can remember at all.
Oh native, you think I am vr or hawkeye or maybe chloro because they ganged up with you to attack other Rafa fans? Hilarious!!! ( hawkeye you could consider patenting that word!)
Sorry I am neither confused nor obnoxious nor oestridae. Keep guessing!!!
I am sure chloro and native remember Twinge, his sharp wit and acid tongue because he reduced them to shivering bits of jelly. Twinge apologized to Chloro because he realized chloro is really a good sort, just led astray by bad company. He apologized to native because Twinge had misguided notions of British chivalry.
Bwahahahahah!
Nice revisionism at work there. Mary, almost every posts of your here so far seems to be aimed at provoking reactions, and trying to set people against each other. Trolling in other words. Perhaps there are more interesting things about tennis and tennis players you could post instead.
Incidentally:
Twinge apologized to all of us collectively as TT was about to be ended… for having written on many occasions all sorts of posts … while being quite drunk.
chloro , me “trying to set people against each other. Trolling in other words ” Oh my God, have I been doing that? native too has been insistent about that. You guys have now convinced me!!! I may resist but there is no escape. I am CHLORO or NATIVE!!!! Boo hoo hoo !!! Oh the horror of it! Scylla or Charybdis! Somebody please tell me this is a dreadful dream!!! That I will wake up and find I am thankfully Lucky or Twinge!
mary,
The truth is I have no idea which poster you were on TT, but you don’t write / think at all like Twinge when drunk and when not drunk. And you don’t write / think at all like Lucky… she wrote posts about TENNIS with her deep understanding and insight.
The other thing is that you are trolling… and I won’t respond to you again.
I’ll end my last post to you by repeating that there are more interesting things you could post about, namely tennis and the male and female tennis professionals we follow.
Vamosrafa, I do see your point re: Nadal’s training. I also think that it is mostly Toni who thinks it’s okay to bend over rules if it means you can get the big W. But at some point, Nadal is going to have to cut him lose on some matters and not listen to everything he says. At least, show respect to the guys who don’t pull cheap tricks when they play you. As much as I dislike JMac (well, except his hands at the net) he at least toned it down when he played Borg. It didn’t put JMac at any disadvantage to show that little bit of deference. He still won an equal number of their contests.
If you can’t see OCD then you are as blind as some Rafans here.
Has nothing to do with Toni.
June 26, 2015 at 12:37 pm,
Armchair doctors can’t be taken seriously.
No I don’t see that as being the main reason for his time-wasting. Usually when asked to pick up pace he does a pretty good job of it and I’ve often seen him get deliberately slower on the important points. Djokovic does this too. And I think Toni has everything to do with it. I’ve seen his attitude toward on-court coaching. Then there’s also the nonsense he pulled with Carlos Ramos concerning time-warnings. So yes, Toni definitely has a role to play here.
OCD symptoms worsen in stressful moments. But you wouldn’t know that nor be aware of all his other rituals and mannerisms that highly indicate OCD.
it’s Roger who curses out umpires when he doesn’t get his way, who points at the wrong mark on clay and who takes bathroom breaks to wait for the sun to move and occasionally grunts while complaining about occasional hunting who is the hypocrite here.
Too funny!!!
^Perfect example.
Thank-you for proving my point.
https://tenngrand.com/2015/06/18/queens-club-qf-previews-and-picks-murray-vs-muller-isner-vs-troicki/comment-page-3/#comment-201800
chloro,
Thanks for setting the record straight. I didn’t want to dignify those comments with a reply, but I think you were right to tell it like it is.
It doesn’t take any guts to attack people behind an anonymous screen name. You calledit for what it is!
nny 🙂
Even though we are all anonymous in terms of our real names… a lot of a person’s personality etc comes through when you read enough of their posts, no? That goes for any and every aspect (good bad ugly boring interesting and so on) that comes through, and that goes for all of us posters.
OxC says:
June 26, 2015 at 12:49 pm,
—And I think Toni has everything to do with it. I’ve seen his attitude toward on-court coaching.—
=============================
.
If saying ‘Vamos!’ is coaching, then coaching is a very simple thing – it consists only of one word! Everybody can do it!
Of course you don’t need any proof that is all Toni is saying because you don’t apply your own rules to yourself now.
Do you?
Or don’t you.
June 27, 2015 at 1:44 pm,
.
The Telegraph, 27 Jun 2010: ¤¤ Wimbledon 2010: Rafael Nadal’s uncle at centre of illegal coaching row.
The world No1 has denied the umpire’s claim that he received coaching during his victory over Philipp Petzschner, but the incident has opened up a debate on the subject.
…
“Toni wasn’t giving me any tips, he was only supporting me,” Nadal said. …
Nadal’s opponent also said that he had not heard any coaching, just a few cries of “VAMOS” from Toni… ¤¤
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/tennis/rafaelnadal/7857620/Wimbledon-2010-Rafael-Nadals-uncle-at-centre-of-illegal-coaching-row.html
So you must believe what Rafa says about Nole’s ROSS is fact also.
“Communications of any kind, audible or visible, between a player and a coach may be construed as coaching. ”
Vamos!!
June 27, 2015 at 6:51 pm,
Your issue with this has nothing to do with me.
June 28, 2015 at 10:37 am,
I am curious to know why there are double standards…?
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CIlVJ6xUYAAxV0i.png
June 28, 2015 at 10:37 am,
I am curious to know why there are double standards…?
==============
Good question to ask yourself indeed.
Maybe you should hire a psychiatrist like Andy. On second thought you might need a team of them.
“I talk to Rafa during matches. I know that it’s not allowed but I think that at my age I have nothing to hide,” Toni told the Spanish journalist David Nadal.
Toni Nadal added that he sees little value in using sports psychologists, and added, “In the tennis world, those who are mentally stronger, are also technically stronger.”
June 28, 2015 at 11:41 am,
—Maybe you should hire a psychiatrist like Andy—
=========================================
.
If my memory serves me correctly, you have someone permanently in your household…
I inquired on your behalf but am told you are a lost cause. Try the yellow pages.
June 28, 2015 at 12:14 pm
—“I talk to Rafa during matches. I know that it’s not allowed but I think that at my age I have nothing to hide,” Toni—
===============================
.
Yep, U.Toni doesn’t deny that he says “Vamos!” (= “Come one!”) and he also says “Move your legs!” (of course in Catalan language, not in English).
I am still curious to know why professional commentators are defending Djoko’s team and are bushing Rafa’s team (see my post on June 28, 2015 at 11:34 am).
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CIl-voXUAAE0_0X.png
So he breaks the coaching rules same as Nole and Andy. As I thought. Nothing new.
June 28, 2015 at 3:05 pm,
Maybe you should ask for help from your household?
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CImLFvkWsAAgqek.png
“Communications of any kind, audible or visible, between a player and a coach may be construed as coaching. ”
Vamos! Move your legs!
@Oxc, Well I don’t think anything can be interpreted about Either rafa or Toni wanting to bend the rules. When Toni was training rafa as a kid, there were no rules having these time violation warnings. I am no expert on these superstitious behaviors but may be it is OCD? I don’t know exactly but they are clearly some superstitions that seem very natural and have been developed by rafa himself to deal with ANXIETY and I don’t think they have anything to do with gamesmanship. Why does he take longer to serve on the big points well that is because his anxiety his at his peak before those points! it is not like he is bouncing the ball 100 times voluntarily to cause delay or something like that, he has his own ‘routine’ and judging from his interviews, he does not like them and wants to get rid of them!
Well, I think rafa’s behavior on the court is very consistent with the humility and respect he has for the game and his opponents! Some people think his fist pumping is to annoy his rivals but that is absurd! Those who say this don’t know anything about rafa. He is fighting the scoreboad out there! he is giving his 100% even when the score in 5-0 in his favor ! It is love for the sport that elicits those reactions
Regarding grunting, well, do you honestly think players spend time in learning how to grunt rather than work on their games? For someone of rafa’s caliber, he does not need these cheap tricks and these cheap tricks distract opponents?! no way, players are not that fragile. There are others who grunt , look at ferrer! so again, habits developed as a child and they become part of the package! If grunting is part of gamesmanship, how do you explain the grunting on every point ! Even when rafa is winning easily, he is grunting whenever he is pushed in a rally! nothing nadal does is associated with gamesmanship. It is all about interpretation
@chloro, 2:13 pm
You make some good points. In the end, we are all anonymous. But it comes down to how we conduct ourselves behind these usernames. I get that. But I don’t like having a kind of witch hunt being conducted on this site and people being targeted if they say even one thing about one of Rafa’s rivals.
I want to talk about tennis. I want to talk about Rafa, but I also want to be able to talk abut Fed, Novak, Murray and others. I want to be able to say if I appreciate aspects of their game. That does not by definition make me a traitor to Rafa!
I don’t like seeing a few here ganging up on others at will and saying such personally offensive things. This “Mary” has come here for the purpose of insulting some people. You can see it for yourself. You responded to it and clarified the record.
When TT was shutting down, Twinge took the opportunity to apologize to us and admit that he was drinking or taking pills or whatever. That took some courage and innate decency. Then to read this person twisting and distorting things and insulting both you and myself, also vamosrafa and hawkeye. Well, we are being targeted by someone who is repeating verbatim the attacks from nadline and augusta.
Some good people have been run off this site for daring to have opinions that disagreed with the select few here. That’s the truth.
Did her TT alias start with ‘C’ ?
June 26, 2015 at 2:22 pm,
—But I don’t like having a kind of witch hunt being conducted on this site and people being targeted if they say even one thing about one of Rafa’s rivals.—
=====================================
.
Oh, people are being targeted if they post a negative FACT about Rafa’s rivals!
Vamosrafa, the 20 second rule was introduced before Nadal turned professional (to my knowledge at least). This is really not an excuse. As for the argument on anxiety-again, there are players who don’t do this. Who play to pace no matter what. What prevents Nadal/Djokovic from mustering the dignity to respect at least those guys? And honestly, Nadal’s anxiety issues look way over-stretched to me. There’s no way he’d be able to do so well professionally if his “anxiety” was that problematic. It’s ridiculously phony to claim that as an excuse. My argument I think is pretty simple: If you cannot respect the opponent on court it doesn’t matter what you say off it. Time-wasting, shady MTOs, endless littany of injury excuses, on-court coaching-none of these point to a semblance of respect in my book. If you find it acceptable I cannot engage on this any further.
Yes it started with a Carrie definitely.
Oooops.
“If you cannot respect the opponent on court it doesn’t matter what you say off it. Time-wasting, shady MTOs, endless littany of injury excuses, on-court coaching-none of these point to a semblance of respect in my book”
Yes like Roger admitting taking a bathroom break against Davydenko at Wimbledon to wait for the sun to move, injury excuses (bad back, mono), pointing to the wrong mark on clay vs Rafa, cursing umpires to their face, breaking racquets, and blaming losses on lucky shots, grunting suddenly, cursing Murray during the match to his face, screaming at the French crowd to shut up. Such respect isn’t exactly peRFectly classy now is it.
On the contrary, sounds just a bit hypocritical to me.
God it’s KILLING Me!!!!
Hilarious,
The 20 second rule was written when tennis was played in long dresses and bonnets.
It was only ENFORCED when Roger whined about it in 2012. Of course he doesn’t want to go as far as s shot clock because then it would have to be called consistently against all players which would prove to be a farce. It wouldn’t be able to single out Nadal.
‘I do believe the officials could be a bit more tough on timing,’ he told reporters at Indian Wells. ‘I’m not complaining a lot, but I don’t know how you can go through a four-hour match with Rafa and he never gets a time violation. It’s natural that even I would go over time, but they never remind us. There are times when they could be a bit more firm. Because at the end of the day, I don’t know if fans are getting frustrated to watch five points that are going to take us five minutes.’
Talking about the possibility to install a shot clock.
‘I hope it does not go that far. All of us should be able to agree of something that is possible. But you don’t want to lose fans because of that.’
Players have been complaining about Nadal’s time-wasting LONG before Roger in 2012 (in fact, that is not even accurate since Roger had been pressing for it since well before then which basically goes to show that when it comes to having an intellectually honest discussion, you chicken out and reinvent some nonsense assuming ignorance on the other side). Incidently, it was Agassi who first pointed it out and was followed by several players/commentators following suit.
In some ways, I’m almost glad Djokovic plays it dirty versus Nadal because that is exactly what the both of them deserve.
As for a shot clock, Roger’s right in saying that what needs to be curbed is the notoriety in time-wasting. Deliberately delaying the game. In fact, he’s bang on target. Good for him.
What is the bathroom break myth perpetuated by the fanboys here? The whole match is available on Youtube and Roger took EXACTLY 2 minutes which is usually the time allotted between two sets. I guess, just a case of shifting blame for dirty play. Plus, if that is the best you could find for Roger, I’ll day he’s doing pretty well. 🙂
As for OCD, again, if it was that bad he wouldn’t be playing professionally and most importantly, he almost always tones it down when asked to. So yeah, just more redundancy from you lot.
I don’t know why shouting at a fan for distracting him has ANYTHING to do with gamesmanship but since you’re good at building strawmen, I’m not altogether surprised.
Breaking racquets? Whaaa..He did like once in 15 years? Who cares? Just another strawman and a cheap ploy for obvious lack of argumentation from your side. Nothing you seem to say appears worth reading to be honest. But I’ll still bite because I do enjoy taking your case. :p
Oxc,
I am not sure which versions of that bathroom break you have heard because there is only one version. It was one of he fines display of gamesmanship through a toilet break!
Davy was bossing federer around the court and fed took a bathroom break to solve a problem for himself:
“When the sun comes from the side, the ball seems half he size and it is just hard to hit. I never take toilet breaks but I thought Why not?” I just hoped that every minute it took , the sun would move another centimeter’.
SO this was pure gamesmanship!
And yeah,, talking about respect. Roger has so much respect for Chair umpires. He abuses them at will , scolds them so that they cannot freely take decisions against him?!!
Come on,, you are losing credibility in your arguments by presenting Federer as a Saint here ,which he clearly is not. And his explanation on why he lost the wimbledon 08 final, it got too dark! Brilliant. That is the worst excuse ever to lose perhaps the greatest match ever.
Rafa’s injuries are not excuses! The guy has suffered so much. Why do you think poor guy has had to take so many breaks from tennis!? His assessments are by far the most honest ! Read his this year’s interviews. So damn honest! Not like roger who after having a miserable season in 2013 said he still believes tennis matches are on his racket!
It’s ok OxC. That’s what all My fans say about My posts yet they can’t tear themselves away!!!
That is My point. The rule was only changed (yes changed) in 2012 after FEDERER complained. But you didn’t know that did you My little scare crow.
Here’s an epic racquet destruction from 2009:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-e-Ud-ly04&sns=em
15 years huh? Federazzi math is hilarious!!!
You do it to yourself My fan.
His OCD has worsened. It’s only become a disorder in the last two years. But you wouldn’t know the definition of a disorder would you.
Federazzi know little about tennis beyond Roger so it’s understandable.
You’re welcome My fan.
http://www.oregonlive.com/the-spin-of-the-ball/index.ssf/2015/06/rafael_nadal_is_a_long_shot_at.html
vamosrafa,
I was going to respond to OxC’s revionist history, but you already did! I don’t know how anyone could even pretend to make excuses for what Fed did in that match at the AO against Davy. Davy came out and was taking it to Fed. In fact, at one point in the second set he had a chance to go up a double break! But he didn’t get it done. Fed admitted it himself!
This absurd idea that Rafa is somehow the only player who engages in gamesmanship, is getting really old. Hawkeye posted a video of Laver back in the day and showed that they took a long time to serve even then. Gamesmanship is part of sport. It’s a way to gain an advantage while still trying to play within the rules. There are times when it gets out of hand and Nastase is a perfect example of that.
You can’t have it both ways, OxC!
Federazzi revisionism is HILARIOUS!!!
spot on NNY! rafa’s time delaying is mostly associated with his superstitious behavior (most likely OCD) but okay, even if he engages in some gamesmanship, it is very much part of the game! Fed’s gamesmanship was the purest of all !
@hawkeye, another classic racket smash took place in the nadal-federer miami 2005 final 😉 may be you could find a video haha..
My he was an angry player during the weak era when he thought every match should be handed to him on a golden platter now wasn’t he. Same year different player.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IM6x-sBoy1k&sns=em
What would mirka say?
vamosrafa says:
June 26, 2015 at 12:13 am
Djokovic was quite immature early in his career but he had evolved wonderfully well and now he is very mature. His sportsmanship is quite admirable.
——————————————————-
What is admirable about smashing the sponsor’s property, shouting obscenities at the spectators or faking injury when on the back foot? You blind loyalty to Djoker knows no bounds.
lol, you chickened away yesterday and now you are back ! in case you pretend to have not seen my posts, they are on the second last page of Rafael Nadal fan page.
and by the way, Djokovic has matured a lot. Look at what federer said the other day. He said he did not like djokovic’s behavior early on but now djokovic is a mature guy whom he respects.
Even rafa would say the same 🙂
You cannot compare him to rafa, of course. As I said earlier, rafa is rafa so everyone’s demeanor looks pale when comparaed to rafa… otherwise, djokovic is a very good sportsman now. he is one of the best losers in the game right now…
I off away for the WE but I hope to catch a bit of Rafa at Boodles this afternoon.
No children, don’t fight. I think everyone knows who is a fan of whom by now and those who are just fair weather fans. No need to continue this futile argument.
Don’t forget to read the post below before chickening out!
@ 8.17am
–––Look at what federer said the other day. He said he did not like djokovic’s behavior early on but now djokovic is a mature guy whom he respects–––––––
He would say that wouldn’t he: Djokovic has just joined the married-man-with-family club and boy is he milking it for all it’s worth.
He has come a long way from the brash teenager he was when he first started out and I am mindful of the struggle it was to survive in his country let alone rise to the very top of his sport.
I agree for a long time he has been a gracious loser. The way he handled the loss at RG was particularly admirable when he had just seen his chance of the Career Slam go up in smoke.
So much of what he says and does is orchestrated with an eye on photo calls and sound bite opportunities for the furtherment of the Djokovic express train.
ed,
That’s how I think of djokovic too: he has clearly matured, and watching him I always have the impression that what we’re seeing is a mixture of authenticity and calculation, sometimes more the one sometimes the other.
And Novak is also the young man most revered (not just most, extremely, as a semi-deity) in his own country. A few years of that would go to nearly anyone’s head.
by the way, your hatred for other players knows no bounds. It is pitiful indeed…. Rafa is the complete opposite.
Toni nadal once said in an interview that he always taught his nephew never to even wish defeat on others! He brought this up in response to a question regarding the french crowd’s behavior in RG 2009 rafa vs soderling. He said I always tell rafael that if he supports real madrid, he should not wish defeat on barcelona! This is very tough to do but one can at least learn not to disrespect and hate!
Some of what Toni said:
“,it’s good to cheer for somebody’s victory but it’s not
normal to wish defeat on somebody else..”I know that a lot of
fans are like that but I think it’s a rather dumb way of going about it. Anyway, we’re not
brought up like that in our family, that’s not what we’ve been taught. It’s for that reason
that I was shocked by the way the Parisian public acted…”
I think it is very common for fans to wish defeat on other players when their man is out of the tournament because you don’t wanna see your man’s rival pulling away with titles.
BUT, the way you show hatred for players like Djokovic and Fed, Toni would feel very sorry for you LOL
@Vamosrafa 8.28am
The cyber-world would be more congenial if the word ‘hate’ was banned on all sites unless it pertains to food. I myself hate anchovies, olives and capers 🙂
I dislike intensely Djokovic’s insincere Mr. Nice Guy persona which he has cultivated to win approval and the bellicose celebrations on winning are a complete turn-off (although his PR people have recently given him a ‘make-over’ in this department). I don’t care for the mind games Federer employs before a big showdown; nor the sting in the tail of his grudging compliments for his main adversaries; Funnily enough I don’t mind his arrogance because he has every right to be proud of his achievements. On the other hand, his conceit and self-love is beyond tiresome.
Nadline is single-minded in her devotion to Rafa and unswerving in her defence of him against all and sundry. But I have never never known her express hatred towards other players – only to some of the obnoxious trolls who turned TT into a nightmare.
Agree with VR on Djokovic – particularly in the last year.
How he handled the loss at the French Open was exemplary.
Also agree with VR about nadline. Good source of entertainment though. And now there are two!!!
ed, I am never putting that much thought and weight in to every single word but if you want to replace hate with dislike, that is fine!
You have tried to stay diplomatic on this which is understandable but you are well aware what kind of ‘defense’ she does around here. Now tell me, how is saying tha tDjokovic has a fantastic ROS or saying djokovic has matured a lot related to anything with Rafa? Yet, you see the typical responses over and over again with points awarded on loyalty! The same old same old!
If someone is saying okay Novak is more well behaved than Rafa and THEN these loyalists come to say their stuff, you can get that to SOME EXTENT but what about these instances?? If you don’t hate/dislike a player, why always try to intervene and negative anything positive said about him? It is not For djokovic but also for Djokovic here!
Whether he does it for PR or for whatever purpose, fact is, he is come a long way from being the silly teenager who claimed to be in control in his match against Rafa in RG 06 QF to the player he is now. He is a lot more mature . WHAT has this anything to do with rafa?! Please explain…
@hawkeye, the way he embraced his loss at RG was very classy! NO WAY one can pretend that well when you are hurt so badly from the inside! There is no harm in admitting that!
Ed, Rafa himself has massive respect for DJokovic ! so cannot his fans have that? we cannot like him but like rafa, at least I can respect what fed and novak have achieved ! of course they are RIVALS and to be honest I am rooting for either Stan or Murray when rafa loses early as I dont want rafa’s rivals to gain ground on him or pull away from him.
Rafa always has great respect for Novak so unless you think he does that for PR, you gotta admit Djokovic is worthy of respect in many but RAFA respects him a lot. Again, I DON’T like djokovic and a lot of what he does but that won’t stop me from saying he has matured and that he has an all-time great ROS!
Correction :
June 26, 2015 at 12:43 pm post, third paragraph
” If you don’t hate/dislike a player, why always try to intervene and negative anything positive said about him? It is not For djokovic but also for Djokovic here!”
I meant NEGATE anything positive said about him… igore the last sentence as I cannot make it myself what I was trying to say LOL
June 26, 2015 at 12:43 pm,
—If you don’t hate/dislike a player, why always try to intervene and negative anything positive said about him? —
==========================
.
The problem with you is that you can’t stand an opinion that’s different from yours.
djoker was being very genuine and classy in defeat LONG AGO…..
remember his demeanour after USO 2010 final…? warmed the cockles of my sentimental heart to see the camaradie between rafa and nole after that match. nole was so affectionate towards rafa and genuinely glad for him for getting the career slam.
rafa himself kept saying how novak’s attitude in defeat at a slam final was incredible and a great example for the kids.
none of that was staged or forced…it was all utterly genuine and very touching…..
—The problem with you is that you can’t stand an opinion that’s different from yours.—
==========================
No the problem is that you and nadline respond to comments regarding TENNIS with comments regarding POSTERS.
And therein lies the difference.
#OneToGrowOn
@augusta, there is onely one problem : you and nadline cannot stand anything good said about rafa’s opponents when funnily. rafa himself is full of compliments for his rivals!
Giving loyalty points and pasting screen shots out of context can turn every discussion into pointless exchanges. perfect examples can be found above. I wrote about 300 words , mostly defending rafa , and nadline chose a few words from there about Djokovic to trigger a pointless argument. same old, same old!
June 26, 2015 at 1:11 pm,
YOU are trolling other POSTERS!
@amy, glad to read your thoughts! I 100% agree! There are things about Djokovic we do not like and we know what they are but what he or any other player does well, should be appreciated. It has NOTHING to do with demeaning rafa or something
@hawkeye, lol, concisely put! You said it better than I could/
vamosrafa (at 1:17 pm),
1) —@augusta, there is onely one problem : you and nadline cannot stand anything good said about rafa’s opponents…—
2) —pasting screen shots—
========================
.
1) People are entitled to give their opinion if they so wish. (I used someone else’s quote.)
2) I present evidences. Every time (maybe not every time) you have accused me, I have asked you to present factual proof, but you have never done this.
Hawkeye,
Thanks for digging that one up! I don’t know where on earth the Federazzi get this nonsense about him never losing it on court, never engaging in gamesmanship, being such a great sportsman! Please! I got a kick out of this one! Nice find! 🙂
amy,
You should be careful about saying such nice things about Novak! You will be branded a Rafa fair weather fan, not a real Rafa fan and a host of other not so nice things.
If anyone here says even one thing complimentary about one of Rafa’s rivals, then they are branded forever. Yet Rafa has had good things to say about Novak’s game. Rafa displays real respect for his opponents. He doesn’t necessarily have to like them as people, but what they bring to this sport he appreciates. I think it takes real confidence and self-assurance to be able to give praise to rivals in a sport.
Rafa has a good heart. He doesn’t not stoop to cheap shots. But those here who claim to be his only true blue, loyal fans, are in reality disrespecting him by relentlessly attacking other Rafa fans here for daring to say anything positive about his fellow players.. I think that’s a real shame.
Watch out guys, if something looks like a duck, walks like a duck, quacks like a duck….it is a DUCK!!!
So if the gang of 4 ‘bigs-up’ Rafa’s rivals ( Djoko has the best ROS, Fed is more popular than Rafa…..all of which are contradicted by stats ) and even bigs up Stan ( he is the best clay courter…!!!) ……And more tellingly attacks and harasses loyal Rafa fans like nadline and augusta for DEFENDING Rafa….. what pray is the conclusion?
vr and nny,
i am maybe the only person here who actually likes nole. (except when he plays rafa when i hurl abuse at him constantly!)
yes he has his faults, but also for me many good points and i feel a lot of affection for him…
if that brings abuse upon me for liking someone then i really couldn’t care less..
i’ve deliberately written this to make it clear where i stand.
No Amy I like Nole too I’d take him any time over Federer.
Nole’s a class act.
amy,
Good for you! Stay true to yourself. I am not a Novak fan, but I do appreciate his talent and his game. So does Rafa! He has spoken many times about Novak’s strengths and how tough he is as an opponent. That’s another reason to love Rafa. He is able to compliment his rivals. He acknowledges their strengths and what they bring to the game.
I will say that the way Novak handled his defeat at RG was very classy. Maybe he has matured and grown up. It’s not easy to take yet another defeat, this one not at the hands of Rafa. However, some of his fans are another thing entirely!
I am happy that you are standing up for what you believe. 🙂
i actually have quite a lot of fondness for fed as well….altho i kind of hate him for the time penalty thing….
does this put me completely beyond the pale?! i guess i will be a target now….?!
but then hey who gives a f***!
Can’t say I’m fond of Federer but his game is undeniably amazing to watch.
#NE1butRF
hawkeye, my feelings about both nole and fed are partly bound up with the incredible tennis that both fedal and rafole have given us. wimby 2008, RG 2013…and so on…
that’s about all 3 players turning tennis into a thing of beauty with lashings of good will and fair play on all sides….
i am very very grateful just to have been able to witness that……
see how sentimental i am!!
A lot can be said but ….I am out of this, not going to contribute to these pointless arguments esp when it is the same old crap.
Boodles has begun for me as rafa is playing today and wimbledon is starting in 3 days. I am going to stick with tennis discussions and I am sure a lot of posters can contribute to them.
Good luck to fellow ‘detractors’ .
Good for you dear vr. You are respected when you stick to tennis ( you are an excellent tennis analyst) not when you troll as part of the gang of 4.
vamosrafa,
I agree with your sentiments! Ifinally was able to watch Rafa’s match at Boodles yesterday. I thought he looked quite relaxed, but then it is an exho with nothing on the line. But I thought he served very well in that match. His movement on the grass was also extremely good. His groundstrokes had nice depth and accuracy and he was moving into the court and being aggressive. Some great volleys at net!
It’s a good thing that he had another match in preparation for Wimbledon. I hope he serves this way when the tournament begins.
I also intend to make every effort to avoid those who have come here for the wrong reasons, mainly to attack, harass and instigate. Not to talk tennis!
The endless carping is a waste of time and energy. There is going to be a lot of great tennis to look forward to and I hope to participate in some quality discussions. 🙂
June 27, 2015 at 3:09 pm,
It would be great if you stop attacking. A long time ago I asked:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CIhj-q8UsAA14Py.png
augusta08 the “victim”
I truly didn’t mean to start a witch hunt when I pondered on the identity of the mysterious newcomer on this site but there now seems to be a consensus as to who it might be.
My apologies if I inadvertently outed you 😉
Ed you needn’t carrie all of the burden.
See what I just did right there?
I hope we haven’t frightened away………………..I was looking forward to being able to hide behind the red and gold sofa she installed for Rafans.
@hawkeye, how do you come up with these gems time and time again LOL
Woohoo!!! It is wimbledon time!!! 0% expectations and 100% hope ( ha ha) !!! The gang of 4 will probably be too busy watching matches to have much time to harass and intimidate loyal Rafa fans!!!! Native, of course, will be watching RECORDED matches as no matter where she lives, the poor thing is always in the WRONG time zone.
I was horrified when native insisted I was she ( sets Rafa fans against other Rafa fans: trademark Native) but no one bought her ridiculous allegations! The general consensus seems to be that I am nadline ( same as carrie I presume from hawkeye’s weak pun?).
Sorry guys, I am NOT nadline. I am proud to be mistaken for her for she is a loyal fan of Rafa, the one GOAT. The gospel according to Rafans….that I myself am he! There is no GOAT besides me. I have been wounded and I am healed, and no one can escape from my powerful (fore) hand.
It would be more fun though to be Twinge! Why? Because I could have sent native and chloro scuttling for cover!!!
Yes, hawkeye, how do you do it, maestro? LOL
and you reminded me of one of my favorite sequences of songs by the 4 golden boys:
Once there was a way to get back homeward
Once there was a way to get back home
Sleep pretty darling do not cry
And I will sing a lullabye
Rafa, you’re gonna carrie that weight
Carrie that weight a long time
Rafa, you’re gonna carrie that weight
Carrie that weight a long time
I never give you my pillow
I only send you my invitations
And in the middle of the celebrations
I break down
Cue rad drum solo …
And in the end, rafa, the love you take
Is equal to the love you make
chloro that reminds me of a post you made a week or so ago, ” apropos of nothing: oestridae” . No one except sharp eyed Mary noticed it. I think everyone should know that you are the scion of the oestridae family! All hail chloro oestridae!!!
@chloro, isn’t it too funny that someone claims to be a ‘he’ and is using a female moniker LOL
Oops, could not resist commenting. *Back to Wimbledon mode*
*golf clap*
This is for sanju. i have published ads in the personal columns of all the major newspapers : Come home, Rafa forehand!!! All is forgiven!!! nadline inconsolable, sanju distraught, native trolling…..Love, Rafafans
Got it at last. But not telling. You’ll have to work it out for yourself 😛
good job ed 😉
Don’t tell, ed. I am an elf. Revealing my name would make me lose my magical powers!!!
So the trolls assume I am carrie and come up with puns and stupid poems and pat each other on the back! Hilarious!!! Using dear vr’s own words, ” comical and delusional” !!!
vr suffers from comprehension problems. Excused as english is not his 1st language. But he sounds comical and delusional when he claims somebody claims to be a “he”. When ? Where? Hilarious!!!!
don’t worry my comprehension skills are top notch. It is just that I go though ‘some’ posts too quickly so a minor slip up…haha
“Native” Mary had a little lamb….And everywhere that ” Native” Mary went,
The lamb was sure to go.
No wonder the respectable analyst vr has gone astray and become a troll.
vr, so your definition of top notch comprehension skills is replying without understanding? Hilarious!!!
Oh snap! 🙂
oh snap!… indeed 😉
Who can identify the antagonists and protagonists in the convoluted drama unfolding on this thread ?
vamosrafa says:
June 26, 2015 at 1:17 pm
“@augusta, there is only one problem: you and nadline ARE NOT FAIR WEATHER RAFA FANS. Rafa himself is full of compliments for his rivals BUT ONLY WHERE COMPLIMENTS ARE DUE!”
Fixed it for you. 🙂
*********************************************
No fans of Rafa’s rivals regularly put down the player they support and continuously sing the praises of his Rafa.
ed251137 says:
June 26, 2015 at 11:54 am
“@Vamosrafa 8.28am
The cyber-world would be more congenial if the word ‘hate’ was banned on all sites unless it pertains to food. I myself hate anchovies, olives and capers 🙂
Nadline is single-minded in her devotion to Rafa and unswerving in her defence of him against all and sundry. But I have never never known her express hatred towards other players – only to some of the obnoxious trolls who turned TT into a nightmare.”
———————————————————–
To people like vamosrafa alias adjienole, pointing out the shortcomings of anyone other than Rafa is hatred. Rafa is the only one in their firing line. Even defending Rafa is an act of hatred towards his rivals.
Nadline10 is trolling. Please do not feed the troll.
hawkeye63 is trolling. His feeders keep him well-nourished.
that’s enough
This is a lesson for Mary’s little lamb who blindly follow her everywhere:
Mary had a little lamb,
She tied it to a pylon;
One thousand volts shot up its ****
And now its wool is nylon.