Rafael Nadal and David Goffin will be facing each other for the third time in their careers when they wrap up the first two days of round-robin competition at the World Tour Finals on Monday night. Nadal has won both of their previous meetings; 6-3, 6-1 in this season’s Monte-Carlo semifinals and 7-6(3), 6-2 in the Madrid quarters.
For exactly two reasons, Goffin may have a better a chance in this one. First, it is on an indoor hard court instead of on clay. Second, Nadal is likely less than 100 percent due to a knee injury.
That being said, Goffin has dealt with physical problems of his own throughout the second half of 2017. The eighth-ranked Belgian suffered an ankle injury in the third round of the French Open, missed the grass-court swing, and did not post another strong result until reaching round four of the U.S. Open–where a knee issue hobbled him during a straight-set loss to Andrey Rublev. Goffin, though, is an impressive 17-5 this fall with back-to-back titles in Shenzhen and Tokyo.
Few players have a better record this season than Goffin (54-22), but Nadal’s 67-10 mark has helped him clinch the year-end No. 1 ranking heading into London. The Spaniard took all suspense out of that equation when he beat Hyeon Chung in his first match at the Paris Masters. Nadal held off Pablo Cuevas in three sets one day later but then withdrew with his knee problem prior to a scheduled quarterfinal contest against Filip Krajinovic.
With more than a week off before getting things started at the O2 Arena, Nadal is reportedly good to go.
“I hope (I am ready),” Nadal said in between practice sessions in London. “And if I didn’t believe I can be ready, I wouldn’t be here. I’m working every day, practicing well and just trying to be ready for the action…. Being here is an important thing, but for me the most important thing is everything that happened to me this year, the tournaments, competing almost every week with a very competitive level of tennis; being healthy until Paris.”
Goffin is here for the second time after playing one match as a World Tour Finals alternate in 2016, when he replaced Gael Monfils and got blown out by Novak Djokovic 6-1, 6-2. The underdog will be much more competitive on Monday, but another loss is forthcoming if Nadal is close to 100 percent.
Pick: Nadal in 2
[polldaddy poll=9870896]
who ya got?
Nadal in 2
likely (if healthy)
D. Goffin hasn’t won a set against R. Nadal, the H2H is 3-0 obviously Rafito is leading.
Rafa defeated Goffin thrice this year, 2 of those wins were on clay, outside clay their match was competitive.
http://www.tennisexplorer.com/match-detail/?id=1629042
Can this match go over 21.5 games?
D. Goffin has the better record on indoors( overall & this year) and he has done well on this court throughout this year.
All the matches Rafa played on indoors this year went over games, Nadal is the favourite to win and might win but can this match go over games?
Nadal in three
Nadal, returning from a break, is a bit rusty on his worst surface and wins in three.
Rafa in very straight sets… losing no more than 7 games.
I think Rafa is healthy, if not he won’t play. I doubt he will run the risk of further damage if he’s not fit but still wants to play.
I think he withdrew from Paris QF because at that time he’s not sure how serious was his injury. I don’t think he and his team are so dumb to let him play when he’s not fit to play.
luckystar AT 7:29 AM;
Rafa is following his doctor’s advice. He talked to his trusted doctor, Ángel Ruiz Cotorro, before pulling out of his R3 match Paris. The doctor advised him not to play. The doctor made a step-by-step recovery plan for Rafa and keeps a watchful eye on him.
https://www.elespanol.com/deportes/tenis/20171104/259474342_0.html
Not R3, QF. At that time Rafa wasn’t sure how serious was the problem, so he took his team’s ( including his doctor) advice and withdrew. I think he went straight to Barcelona after that to get his knee checked.
Notice that he was fine during set 1 vs Cuevas, but his game went down in set 2, not serving well and not hitting well; probably he felt more pain in set two (and three), that he dare not put too much pressure on his knee, for fear of further damage. He didn’t want to retire from the match so he endured and continued till the finish line.
Luckystar AT 9:56 AM,
Yes, Rafa went straight from Paris to Barcelona to get his knee checked. It’s written in the article I linked. The article is in Spanish, try to read it via Google Translate.
Here is an excerpt via Google Translate:
¤¤ Ángel Ruiz Cotorro, Rafael Nadal’s trusted doctor, received the tennis player at his clinic in Barcelona on Friday afternoon and immediately started to work.
First, the doctor did several tests to see the condition of the patellar tendon of the right knee, which forced Rafa not to play in the quarterfinals of the Paris Masters.
Secondly, he wanted to see if the injury is exactly the same as Rafa suffered during the Asian tour (the knee joint stress) and which forced him to withdraw from the tournament in Basel.
And thirdly, he chose a specific treatment, the goal of which is recovering in time to play at the WTF in London.
“It is not a new injury or an injury that has worsened,” Cotorro explained by telephone to this newspaper [EL Espanol]. “It’s not a different situation than when Rafa came from the Asian tour. All the images of the tests tell us that it’s the same problem – the knee tendon is suffering,” added the doctor, who had already consulted the Mallorcan after Shanghai and diagnosed the knee joint stress accumulated during the long season.
“Rafa has played a lot of matches this season. The knee tendon is suffering, but the images do not show us anything new [different than after Shanghai]: it’s pain in a stressful situation.”
“Rafa did the right thing by retiring,” said Cotorro, who spoke with the player on Friday morning and supported him in his decision not to jump on the court.
“The problem of tendons in different situations may bother more or less, but we are going to try to be fit to play in London. If he is fit, he’ll play, and if he is not fit, he’ll give up playing. We’ll see how things evolve in the coming days. ”
Thus, on Friday, Rafa began a specific treatment that will combine physiotherapy, rehabilitation and muscle strengthening in Mallorca, trying to recover in time to play at the WTF in London.¤¤
I don’t see how rafa is healthy, based on what he says (he “hopes” to be 100%) and on his recent form. Unless he was tanking a bit in Paris, which is more unlikely than anything imo, he clearly wasn’t fully fit. Nor did he seem to be in Shanghai final. Why think he’s healed up completely?
So I’m still surprised Rafa is playing. I suspect he’ll use this match as a bit of a gauge, and if he doesn’t feel right he’ll pull out. I think the match will be close, as Goffin has picked it up a bit lately and is more comfortable on this surface.
Come on, I’ve already explained. It’s normal to feel pain in his knees(according to him), as long as it’s bearable and not a new kind of pain and as long as he knows what’s the problem about.
He pulled out of Paris QF out of caution(according to Moya as reported in one of Moya’s interviews), not wanting to aggravate the issue, when he still had one more important tournament to go (WTF). Rafa’s knees will not always be at 100%, so he’ll play his tournaments knowing there will be pain but no further damage.
It’s just like Fed would feel his back issue after playing his matches, but it’s not serious enough that he couldn’t play his next match as long as he could rest it between matches.
It may be normal for him to feel pain in his knees, but that still doesn’t explain the difference in playing form. Maybe he was feeling pain in his knees at RG final, but there was no evidence of it. Very different case in his 3-4 most recent matches.
Read Rafa’s comment at the ATP website; he said he’s not worried about meeting Fed here as he’s healthy and would try to find new ways to overcome Fed.
It’s not gonna be easy this time around against Goffin. He knows Rafa might not be fully fit and will try to play more and change directions. Rafa wins in 3 or drops.
R. Nadal won’t be playing WTF if he wasn’t fit or healthy, if he plays which he will, please let no one make an excuse if he loses a match or the title.
Please don’t bring up injury or the surface of the court, this is tennis and this guy’s are pros, they are not novices.
Everyone at this stage of the tournament is struggling with something- back pain, fitness, knee, age etc.
When Rafa loses he does his best to lose with grace and he comes back fighting again with a hunger that I admire, I hope rafans learn 4rm him.
When R. Federer wins he does his best to win with humility and he is sincere about it, Federistas should always be humble and not rub it in too much, because you never know, next season might be R….’s.
When we do this two things( lose with grace and win with humility) with dignity, together we will make tennis great again, greater than it’s ever been and conversing with each other will be sweet.
✌👌👊!
Whoa, since when it’s easy against Goffin? Are you mistaking Rafa for Fed against Goffin? Fed vs Goffin is always easy save for that first match they had at FO some years back.
Rafa defeated D. Goffin twice on clay and once on hard( exhibition in Dubai) this year, it was easy 4 Rafa on clay but not on hard and this time it might/won’t be easy.
Nadal might win but Goofing will push him.
http://www.tennisexplorer.com/match-detail/?id=1629042
Nadal will beat Goffin and then depending on the speed of the court may even not play the other matches. If he does play then, he will lose again to Roger either in the semis or the final http://www.138mph.com/tennis-analyzing-nadals-prospects-with-thiem-dimitrov-and-goffin-in-his-group-at-the-atp-finals/
https://www.google.co.in/amp/s/www.express.co.uk/sport/tennis/878593/Rafael-Nadal-Roger-Federer-ATP-World-Tour-Finals/amp
So what is the real deal about rafa…is he reasonably fit or not…above article says behind the scenes charter says he is not.
I meant chatter above
Why do you like to read articles from express.co.uk? I read some and imo they’re mostly gossip materials. My advice is, please don’t read them, don’t get yourself confused.
I think Rafa’s knee is an issue and its not a small issue. I am assuming Rafa will go for a full rest for 1 month till December 20. If his knee injury still remains, then it is going to be troublesome for Rafa next year. He has to me smart in scheduling from now on.
He has not played a lot in last 1 month. Injury should have healed b now if it had been a minor injury.
Huh? Last one month he played at Beijing and Shanghai – ten matches! If not for the YE no.1 ranking, he could have skipped both Basel and Paris, thereby giving himself four weeks rest.
He was hitting ok during his practice session, just not serving well, perhaps not willing to push his knee too hard. He looked ok when he’s running.
He has played 2 competitive matches in last 4 weeks. Dont count practice sessions, real matches require different intensity.
luckystar AT 3:17 PM,
As for Rafa’s parctice sessions in London, his doctor did not allow him to serve before Thursday.
fedexal AT 3:10 PM
Rafa has used his off-seasons to receive theraphy. I am sure he & his doctors know what to do during the upcoming off-season.
That is not accurate. A knee injury does not have to be serious if it takes a while to heal. Tendonitis can be stubborn.
There is no way Rafa’s doctor would let him play if he thought it was serious.
If you ever had knee tendonitis then you would know that it can take a while to settle down once it’s inflamed.
The last thing we need here is armchair doctors talking about things which they don’t know enough about.
Just to be clear, my last post was in response to fedexal’s comment at 3:10 pm.
Yeah I don’t think tendinitis is actually usually too serious.
I’m sure Rafa will still fight through this one. If anyone can fight through an injury to win this kind of match, it’s Rafael Nadal.
Yeah, and I don’t think he’ll play like that Cuevas match.
Yeah I don’t think Rafa can play any worse than he did vs Cuevas and even then he won. Shows what a mental beast he is.
it was Cuevas
Ok good point 😂
If it’s tendonitis ( perhaps through over stressing the knee), then perhaps some painkillers or injections may ease the pain. I think during the year end break, Rafa can then have his SCT to speed up the recovery.
The SCT really works wonder for his troubled knees, at least he managed to be injury free (though it won’t be pain free after each match) until end of Shanghai event. Had he skipped some events, like Rome or even Laver Cup, his knee might be better I guess.
Any match win is 150 points. If Rafa wins against Goffin and does not feel right, he can further assess and thats why he is here. His knee is not so bad that he can’t play. He withdrew from Paris to give himself right. But knee is not perfect as well.
Each win is 200 points, so the more he wins, the more he pulls away from Fed. He wants to keep his no.1 ranking for as long as possible I believe. Of course I believe his knee is not that bad that he’ll hurt it further should he play, so he decides to play. I doubt he wants to risk further injuries and does the stop/start all over again.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BcsXYs-NXf0
This is from his practice with Zverev. I can see that he is NOT at all being explosive with his service motion. He is not taking off like he normally would to hit his serve. Is it precautionary? He will struggle a lot if his first serve is not 100%
Maybe he is just holding back to give his body as much rest as he can before using his energy reserves to explode into the serve in his match? If he’s playing tomorrow I’m guessing that’s what he’s doing.
D. Goffin won’t make it easy for R. Nadal, if rafa is not careful he will lose this match.
If he defeats rafa it would have nothing to do with rafa’s knee, D. Goffin is the injured player and his knee is bad.
Whoever loses, no excuses please.
Stan, if Goffin wins tomorrow it will be because he is the better player currently on indoor hard courts. One has to give complete credit to Goffin then for his superior skills on this fast IH surface.
Rafa’s knee is strained or injured a bit from overuse (70+ games in 2017 on many surfaces. That is too much for any human being.) and not broken. So, Rafa should play at full strength (if he wants to win).
If Rafa doesn’t have any knee issues and restricted movement, then Rafa should win. It could be an ugly match like he played versus Cuevas recently. Note, Goffin is in far better and consistent form than Cuevas. So, just imagine how tough this match will be. Hoping that Rafa doesn’t get blown away in 2 sets as 1000’s have bet millions of dollars on a Nadal’s win!
This could be a 3-setter or 2 long sets (like their last H2H match on hard surface in 12/2016). Note that Rafa’s knee was perfect (pending studying of Rafa’s knees,discussion with his doctor etc.!lol) and strong then in 12/2016 and it still went over games (6-4, 7-6 = 23 games).
Now with a compromised knee of Rafa and with Goffin’s better game and form om IH, this can be a 3-setter or atleast go over games. But, anything can happen in tennis sometimes (like the will to win shown by Benneteau in the Paris Open where he beat many FAV’s like Tsonga, Cilic etc. before tiredness and father age caught up with the old man Benne…) overriding the Statistical & form analysis.
If Rafa can bring his Spanish Bull mentality (win at any cost), then he can win a tight game.
Won the over bet on Roger vs Jack Sock besides Roger -1.5? Couldn’t post that prediction as was very busy with the weekend mma’s profitable event.
Vamos “Ruf,Ruf,Ruf…and Tough” Rafa!
The WTF courts are playing faster this year.
http://metro.co.uk/2017/11/13/how-fast-is-the-atp-finals-court-roger-federer-alexander-zverev-marin-cilic-and-jack-sock-discuss-7074036/
Each of them said different things; Cilic said the court is slower than Paris; I doubt it’s a quick court, at least not as quick as Shanghai. Perhaps, according to Fed, it’s still quicker than the O2 Arena in 2015.
Fed last won this event in 2011, a good six years ago; Djoko won it four times and Murray once in that period. It seemed the court surface favored their style more (no wonder Fed was talking about the baseliners in his comment).
If Rafa is fully fit he should be beating Goffin, and I think that will be the result here. While there are uncertainties over his knee, I think he should still have too much for Goffin. While Goffin has a good game he’s struggled in the past against the very best in the game, with him winning only one match against the ‘Big Four’ throughout his career underlying this fact. Goffin will need to produce a stunning performance here, but I just can’t see it happening. I think Rafa starts with a win here in London, as he sees off the Belgian in straight-sets.
Given that vr has commented on his less than ideal serve motion not sure what to expect from rafa. His serve has vastly improved and if he cannot unleash it due to the knee , foolish to expect anything of him here.
Let’s not forget that D. Goffin also has an injury on his knees.
You won’t see him crying about it or complaining.
#Noexcuses
Whoever wins, wins, if Rafa loses and I don’t think he should lose because… he is the favourite 2 win but if he loses it would have nothing to do with his knee.
Please stop making excuses b4 the match starts, Rafa won’t be playing if he wasn’t fit or healthy, you guys are trying to make Rafa the underdog with silly excuses so that when he loses a match or the title you can whine, complain and make excuses.
Rafael Nadal is #1 in Atp rankings for goodness sake, please grow up and stop acting silly.
Kettle calling the pot black 🙂
Sanju AT 11:01 AM,
You always sound like a prophet of doom.
Gussie
You know full well Sanju can be pessimistic both before and during Rafa matches regardless of whether he is carrying an injury or not. It’s her way of controlling her nerves during closely contested matches.
In other words anti-jinxing!
His way 🙂
Sissy!
He is the prophet of doom.
OK he is not 😂🤣😁😂!
Be calm, be focused, be confident, be courageous, be strong, Rafa!
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DOhxKm-WsAA7ov_.jpg
The evidence suggests Nadal is maybe 80% on a surface that doesn’t favour his game. His serve especially looks to be weakened. Goffin in 3, maybe 2.
Good luck, Rafa!
😍
Nice! I like that.
Native in which set do you think Rafa will win in 2 or 3?
I know that you don’t want him to lose, so which set?
D. Goffin vs R. Nadal who is playing well in the 1st set I need to bet on who is likely to win the 1st set on “live bet”.
I am not watching the match live but I know Goffin broke Rafa’s serve.
Is he playing really well?
Rafa broke back, well done.
I wrote this a long time ago but I just realized I didn’t hit post.
Goffin breaks again and will serve for the first set. To my eye, Nadal’s serve speed has declined since start of the match. He is shanking a lot of balls and doesn’t look comfortable. Part of that is that Goffin has played quite well; he is dominating the baseline rallies. Let’s see if he has the nerve to serve it out.
Massive choke from Goffin to give the break back to Rafa!
how is he moving
Rafa is bad boy, he is a fighter.
Wow. That was one of the weakest service games I have ever seen. I forgot just how un-clutch and mentally weak Goffin is.
beenSanju
Apologies. You should have corrected me after all the years we have been chatting.
I don’t know who deserved to win that set less. I guess it was Nadal because he really played poorly. But how many chances did Goffin blow? Maybe he’ll be able to calm down now.
I’m becoming more and more irritated listening to my least favourite commentator eulogising over Goffin.
Time for Rafa to pull his socks up!
Are you referring to me, Ed?
No Jor. Im talking about the TV commie.
And that is a typo above Joe
Ah, my tv commentator is more focused on Rafa.
Lucky you!!!
Rafa is making heavy weather of this match
I can’t really tell if his knee is affecting him. He seems to be moving well, but his serve speed is down. He certainly is making more errors than usual.
Yeah, and Rafa is so stingy in hitting his FHDTL or his aggressive BH, he maybe wants to keep them safely inside the tool box and not wanting to use them.
He’s hitting too short and allowing Goffin to step in to take the ball early, his game is not working well today.
Can’t say I’m surprised at this. Nadal isn’t currently fit enough to compete at his best here. Goffin taking advantage. About to serve out the win.
Yes, but Goffin needs to stay aggressive. Two amazing BHs in a row from Nadal says he’s not done. And a DF gifts him the break.
Well I meant “attempt to serve it out.” And he couldn’t. Rafa still in this 🍿
Rafa will withdraw today, most probably.
After seeing this match so far, I hope he doesn’t. He’s not obviously injured, and I was surprised to see he’s not even taping his knee. He’s not played well overall, but I think he should keep going.
No point in turning up for WTF with this preparation. Its the same situation that Fed ended up in USO
Well, preparation and fitness is one thing; injury is another. Only the last is a good reason to not play.
You need all three to win a tourney like this. Even great Fed found it the hard way in USO.
Yes, well, I thought he shouldn’t play as well, because I thought ‘why play unless you can win?’ But if he’s here to gain points and participate, there’s nothing wrong with that.
I still think Goffin is the weakest of all top 7 fit players who have turned up for WTF.
Perhaps. But if Goffin could learn to play the big points the way he plays the rest of them, he would be top five, imo.
Goffin can’t close lol. I’ll honestly be shocked if he still wins this in two or in three for that matter.
7 DFs from Goffin, most of them at crucial moments. Amazing that Nadal will probably win this set, but also testament to his incredible will to win and never say die attitude.
RIP Goffin 😂
Vamos Rafa! One set apiece.
Why Rafa is so stingy; why can’t he play like that last service game before the TB more often? Why save such play until he’s facing MPs? Don’t understand his logic.
He seems to be playing very nervous or the knee is probably boring him there. To be honest, Goffin should have closed the match, glad that with his resilience Rafa found a way to capture the set, despite playing poorly. I hope he can win this now.
Vamos Rafa 💪💪💪
Could say the same about Goffin: why, when he has an advantage (including match points!) does he play so tenatively? Why does he double fault at such crucial moments? Nadal has definitely not been the better player so far but he has been far more clutch.
He felt the pressure there big time, he definitely hasn’t the mental strength of a top 10 player, which is sad given his ability.
What a fighting spirit, a brave heart, unbelievable Nadal! He is obviously playing with pain but still fighting! He brings tears in my eyes! What a champion he is!
Rafa you truly are the best!
Natashao, what do you see that suggests Nadal is hurt, besides his relatively poor play?
God, I hope that Rafa is not playing in pain!
No ain’t.
No his not.
I knew this match won’t be easy as some were suggesting, this is tough.
Whoever wins, they really deserve it.
Congrats in advance.
In the 2nd set I placed a bet that D. Goffin will win at 1.95, I just placed another one at 1.35.
Just a small amount, let’s see what happens.
Anyone who thinks he will pull out after one round (unless he is injured) does not understand Rafa’s nature. True he is tired and jaded but there’s no way he would’ve taken to the court if he didn’t intend to fight till the end. Besides the RR format – not to mention the complicated scoring system – makes it impossible to predict who will make it to the final in advance.
If after one match he doesn’t feel right about his knee then I won’t be surprised that he’ll pull out.
I agree he would pull out if the knee is getting worse but that is different from a premeditated decision to only enter for one round.
Looks like he will pull out. I guess he’s testing his knee in this first match, but it’s obvious he couldn’t serve well, and the serve is crucial playing on this court. The way he waved to the fans while leaving the court, it’s like waving them goodbye. I think he’ll make his announcement soon.
He will pull out for sure.
Goffin gets the double break. Even he should be able to see this one out.
Rafa is obviously playing with pain! His painful grimacing, the commentator kept pointing out and they showed replay of his uncomfortable movements! Are we watching the same match?? The commentators said that even Toni Nadal said Rafa should not play at the WTF!
Rafa’s movement is hampered, he doesn’t put strength in his shots, trying to shorten the points! Rafa is a fighter but I think he shouldn’t have played at all..,
The commentator just said: Nadal even though playing on one leg managed to break Goffin again”.,,
Nadal grimaces all the time on the court. And his movement has been terrific in this match, though less so in the 2nd set. The only objective evidence I can see, apart from generally poor play, is a reduced serve velocity.
Sorry, I meant his movement hasn’t been quite as good in the 3rd set.
I agree, prior to the match, that he shouldn’t have played, based on his recent form and the apparent injury to his knee. But if it’s still injured, why isn’t it taped?
Silly excuses, I knew it.
https://tenngrand.com/2017/11/11/world-tour-finals-preview-and-prediction-nadal-vs-goffin/comment-page-1/#comment-287302
Rafa can still win but his fans or some of his fans are crazy, whenever he loses one excuse to other, it’s just shameful and the match ain’t over, you should be hopeful and stop making crazy excuses.
Stanley:
Stop crowing. Nobody is making excuses. Rafa’s compromised movement was there for all to see. And Goffin overcame his own knee problem to battle his way through to the win.
But the match was riddled with UEs and not a prettty sight to watch..
It’s not for nothing it is named the W**t T** F**k tournament
Ed, calm down.
We will talk later, I am taking care of some stuffs.
Goffin smartly taking advantage of Rafa’s hampered movement and trying to move him around…the commentator saying that during the commercial break they played numerous scenes of Rafa’s painful grimacing and he also stated that he would expect Rafa to withdraw after this match…
Goffin was not 100% fit, he has his own problems, please stop making stupid excuses.
That’s very sad for us Rafa fans, but the true is that the knee started bothering him more and more at the beginning of the third set. He fought bravely as always but the injury has caught him 😥
I did not see the second set. But I did record it. I tuned back in for the third set and that was when I started seeing signs of grimacing and pain from Rafa.
I really dislike anyone trolling this site with despicable comments about making excuses. Anyone who has eyes could see that Rafa was hampered. I have had it jlbto here with those who refuse to see what is right in front of them.
Rafa obviously wanted to play. But as the match wore in, he was clearly struggling.
I have nothing to say to someone who persists in trying to inflame and instigate Rafa fans by saying things that are simply untrue.
My only concern now is for Rafa. I hope he rests his knee and gets better. He gave it a try and the knee just is not fully healed.
I am proud of Rafa for fighting so hard and through the pain. For the record I sound never stoop so low as to trash Fed and act like he was fine if he was injured. He deserves more respect than that.
So does Rafa!
You said it all Nny. Rafa’s told his box during changeover: “I can’t anymore”. Imagine how unbearable was the pain that our champion was feeling given that sentence. Now he’s going home, taking a good rest and preparing himself to be ready for a great season next year.
For those who said Rafa was fully fit, take a look at this pictures.
https://mobile.twitter.com/genny_ss/status/930200386408996865/photo/1
https://mobile.twitter.com/genny_ss/status/930200386408996865/photo/2
https://mobile.twitter.com/genny_ss/status/930200386408996865/photo/3
https://mobile.twitter.com/genny_ss/status/930200386408996865/photo/4
Gaviria,
That first picture was when I knew just how much pain Rafa was in. For him to show it like that, you know it was bad.
I did not know that he told his box that he can’t take it anymore.
He really fought like a champion.
It’s great having a new Rafa fan here to share the agony and the ecstasy of being a Rafa fan!
😀
I’m so grateful for your words Nny. Having the pleasure and the enormous privilege of being a fan of Rafa has been an experience for which I have no words, a great whirlwind of emotions. With his war spirit and tremendous passion for the game, he has been able to come back off so many injuries,either physical or pshycological, and give us so many joys, which makes everything very emotional for us, his fans. Certainly I will never admire so much a sportsman as I admire him, he always has been such a great source of inspiration on so many levels. The day of his retirement（hope it’s far away） will be one of the saddest days in the history of sport without any doubt.
You can not imagine how happy I am because you mentioned me Nny. After all, you, lucky and vamosrafa are my favorite posters. Happy to be part of the Rafa clan here at the Grandstand 😊
Gaviria,
Thanks for the heads up in the other topic thread about your response!
You are so gracious and kind! It really is a privilege to be a Rafa fan! He is an exceptional person and athlete. He has come back so many times from injuries. He has never lost the passion for the game.
I cannot imagine what it will be like when he finally hangs up his racket. It will leave a huge void in my life. But we have been given so much. I guess we can’t be greedy. It can’t last forever. It’s been just an amazing ride.
I have often spoke of Bjorn Borg as my first tennis love. He walked away at the age of 26 and broke my heart. I never thought I would find another great tennis love. But I did the first time I saw Rafa. I knew it immediately. He was the one.
I have so much admiration for Rafa. But there will be no replacing him. That’s why I try to enjoy every great victory. I want to stay in the moment.
It’s been special and we are so lucky!
It’s great having you here!
🤗
Well said, NNY.
Finally. Huge win for Goffin; hopefully it will be the start of another move up the rankings for him.
Unlikely, Goffin has 7 DFs, I think his knee isn’t quite right. He will most probably lose to Dimi next. Don’t forget he still has DC final to play, he’s doing more damage to his knee.
Lucky, what do you think of Rafa’s knee after this match?
Refer to my posts of 10.34 and 11.01 PM.
Yes it will.
Congrats to D. Goffin, woooohooo!
Yeah baby!
💪💪💪!
Rafa really played well, congrats to him as well, he is a fighter but still woooooohoooo!
Rafa wasn’t the only player on court that was injured, he didn’t lose this match because of injury, he lost because D. Goffin was the better player today and the better player on indoors hard court, please check the record both current and overall.
http://www.tennisexplorer.com/match-detail/?id=1629042
https://tenngrand.com/2017/11/11/world-tour-finals-preview-and-prediction-nadal-vs-goffin/comment-page-1/#comment-287113
Native if I can give you a hug I will, it will be a big hug, don’t worry about a thing OK, Rafa will be fine.
He can still qualify from his group, he can do it.
Vamos Rafa!
Rafa withdrew from the ATP Finals. His post-match press conference:
https://youtu.be/rf1wmSl8vN0
That was so gracious from Rafa! A class act all the way! He focused on the good things that happened this season. He has such a good heart.
I wish it could have ended differently for Rafa. I know he wanted to at least try to play. But he really is extraordinary in dealing with disappointments.
Rest well Rafa! You have given us precious memories, historic victories and so much happiness!
Come back healthy in 2018!
😍
Rafa is amazing. Never loses perspective, never forgets his good manners and never, ever treats a person like a functionary. Always “grateful to the life” and knows that “life can’t always be perfect”.
See, Rafa has made his announcement that he’s withdrawing from the tournament; he said it’s the end to his season.
Rest and recovers well Rafa, and comes back fully fit for 2018; not forgetting pick and choose your tournaments wisely, plays a well planned schedule and please no more overplaying!
Rafa is so sweet, not forgetting to wish everyone Merry Christmas and he said ‘see you next year’.
He is sweet, I wish him the best and I hope recovers fully.
Merry Christmas to him and to all in advance.
If he wasn’t fit, why did he play?
I don’t like this kind of things, it makes the victory of another awesome guy( D. Goffin) look weak.
Tonight was yet another testament to the unbelievable determination of Rafa. The guy was grimacing in pain through much of the match, and was on the verge of losing multiple times, and still never waivered from his determination to win.
I can’t help but feel a little concerned for Rafa going forward… How much of a lasting effect is all the strain he put on that tendon this season going to have on him going forward? Hopefully the tendinitis is such that, as long as he takes multiple weeks off, it doesn’t flair up again for a long time once he returns from that long break. I just worry that he could get into a scenario where, even if he takes a month long break or however long, he is only able to play competitively for a week or two at a time before the pain becomes too much again.
Yes, he was able to be fine through most of the season this year, but I just don’t see how a condition like he has won’t get worse as he gets older and puts more strain on that knee. I worry that he will end up in a situation similar to Andre Agassi at the end of his career where he has to get cortisone shots (or whatever the stuff is called) just to take the court.
One thing that I don’t have any doubt about is that his knee should at least be fine for those 2 weeks in Australia. It could be that his knee will be totally fine for next season as long as he truly rests it for the next couple months. Who knows? It’s just hard not to worry for him as his knee problems are only guaranteed to get worse as time goes on. I just hope that it doesn’t start really taking a serious toll for a long time.
End of the season knee problems are nothing new for Rafa. He’s had to deal with them since at least 2008. It’s the main reason he missed so many YEC’s. I’ve been concerned the whole year. They crop up when he wins a lot. Sort of like Roger’s back problems. Play too much and he starts hurting. Obviously he should not have attempted to play the YEC, but I love him for trying – and trying to win. I don’t think champions err on the side of caution.
Not to worry, Rafa was able to play through the whole season without injury not because of rest, but SCT. If I’m not wrong, he had it at every year end from 2013 onwards. The SCT enabled him to live his normal daily life without pain in his movements; it’s only when he plays tennis matches that he will experience pain, mostly bearable ones unless it gets serious like in this tournament when he felt he won’t be able to continue.
Sportsmen/women would often experience pain because they subjected their bodies, muscles, joints etc to extreme pressure during competition week after week and year after year. I believe there may be others doing the SCT to sustain or maintain their bodies to be ready for competition and the daily/weekly grinds.
Rafa came to London to be honored his ATP World Tour No 1 Trophy! Naturally he showed up for one match to treat his fans and all the people who came to watch him play! Rafa would’ve withdrawn even if he won today…
Rafa is a role model and we are so lucky to be his fans! He is well deserved No1 and he won two GSs this year, his amazing LaDecima! So happy for him!
Rafa needs rest and recovery! He will be back! Love you, Champ! You brought so much joy to all of us!
Vamos Rafa!
Not the ending to the season Nadal deserved. At least he went out fighting in a match he almost certainly would have won healthy. Get well Rafa!! We need another Fedal showdown at the AO!! 🙂💪🏼
Agreed, Benny!
As I said before, I don’t think Rafa should have played this tournament, and I’m a bit surprised that he did. Really don’t see the point of playing one match, and if he had withdrawn beforehand it would have given someone else a chance to play.
Still, congrats on a great season to Rafa, and I hope to see him back to full health in the new year.
Joe, someone else, who’s PCB has the chance to play; he’s the first alternate here! It’s not as if Rafa has deprived another player a chance to play, when it’s still PCB next in line (at no. 9 to qualify).
What’s your complaint about? Rafa is here to receive his YE no.1 award; he also wants to play as he said he has been skipping too many WTFs due to injury, he doesn’t want to skip another.
The point of playing tournaments, for top champions, is to win the tournament. Rafa himself has said so before. In his last two tournaments, I don’t think Nadal entered to win the tournament.
In Paris, I think he entered to gain enough points to secure world #1, something both he and Federer said they wouldn’t do. Still, fair enough. He earned it, and I certainly don’t fault him for that. He thought he had a good chance, won a couple matches, and then realized he should pull out because of injury.
However, as I and many others have said (both Rafa and Fed fans), there was no good reason to play WTF. Everyone knew his knee was injured, based on his recent form and the fact that he pulled out of Paris for that very reason. He already had YE#1 wrapped up, he had no real chance of winning the tournament, and he had a decent chance of making his injury worse. So why play? My view is that he shouldn’t have.
Injury is always a good reason not to play, regardless of how many times one has had to skip a tournament due to injury before.
In all sports, athlete’s try to play with injury before they know how bad it is in competition.
Nothing new.
Why did Federer lose in a 250 against a Donkey?
No difference.
That’s true, though the structure of tennis (tournaments) may be a relevant difference to other sports. In any case, I said I don’t fault Nadal for using that reasoning in Paris. But I think he and his team knew that the knee wouldn’t hold up in London.
Not sure how Federer’s case is relevant. Do you think he lost on purpose to Donskoy to get out of the tournament? He had match points and has won that tournament many times before.
Different how? All sports are on a continuum and all elite athletes tend to push themselves. Nadal is no different.
I don’t think his team knew that at all. Why would he play if they knew that??? Would be stupid.
Federer wasn’t relevant until you brought him into it.
You said Rafa and Federer said they would never do “that” (like MeatLoaf) yet Federer looked like he had no interest vs Donskoy to the point that one might say him and his team knew he wasn’t going to win the tournament.
So you say that you don’t blame Rafa. For what exactly? In other words, what’s the difference between blaming him and criticizing him?
Seems contradictory to me.
“You said Rafa and Federer said they would never do “that” (like MeatLoaf)” LOL. Any good theories on what MeatLoaf were referring to?
I was referring to chasing points for #1. But maybe I’m wrong. And maybe you’re right that there is no important difference between tennis and other sports in this regard. Michael Jordan took to the court for game 7 with the flu (so they say), and back in the 80s a guy played in the Super Bowl with a broken leg.
I can’t remember the Fed-Donskoy match well enough to draw any conclusions. I guess the fact that he held match points and took it to a 3rd set tie-break suggests to me that he was trying to win the match.
I can understand why Rafa wanted to play London. I just think it was the wrong decision, based on evidence leading up to the match. If I’m criticizing him for anything, I guess it’s entering the tournament knowing that he would likely only play one match.
Um, “pleasuring” I’m guessing.
Not sure they said that exactly but they’ve both said they wouldn’t play tournaments if they didn’t think they would have good chances to win. Federer doubled down to the extreme on that and dropped out of the WTF final vs Djokovic on record as saying not that he defaulted because he couldn’t play, but because he didn’t think he could win (regardless of the fans who paid top dollar to see the final).
And I didn’t say it was the same. I asked you it may be a relevant difference.
You can hold match points without wanting to win a match – could be why he didn’t convert.
You assume he knew that that was likely. So you are criticizing him for something you assume he knew and I expect that he knew no such thing and that he wouldn’t know until he pushed it in competition, just like many other elite athletes in any other sport, particularly when it’s one with such thin competition that he’s never won before.
Quite understandable in my opinion.
I always thought Fed should have played that WTF final. (Actually, Stan should have played it if he hadn’t choked the SF away).
I think just about EVERYBODY but Federer thought he should have played that final.
Stan is 0-15 vs Fed on hc.
He’s a choke vs Fed unless it’s clay, Fed’s worst surfrace.
I’m curious to know…. What would happen if both Rafa and Goffin withdraw? Do they have a second alternate waiting in the wings? Can they bring in DelPo??
I doubt they would at this point. More likely the other two would simply move on to the semis.
Who said so? Both PCB and Querrey will get to play should Rafa and Goffin withdraw. They have to complete all RR matches. I don’t think the rule is so simple that the remaining two would move to SF automatically. Why do you think they have alternates in the first place (and two of them)?
Delpo’s not coming. They usually do have a 2nd alternate available. PCB, of course, will take Rafa’s spot in the draw.
Querrey
Delpo is not coming because he wanted to go home to rest; if not he would be the second alternate, not Querrey.
Goffin is fine
I really don’t know what some are ranting about, that Rafa deprived another player of qualifying? It would still be PCB who’s no. 9 in line where qualifying for the WTF is concerned.
Some hope that Delpo could play but too bad Delpo didn’t qualify and didn’t make it to no.9 so no, he’s not playing whether he’s here or not because PCB is the first alternate and would take Rafa’s place now that Rafa withdraws.
I just wish Delpo had beaten Isner in Paris. It was just one match too much for him, unfortunately. He already had to play so much tennis to even get to that last match. It’s too bad he didn’t play better earlier in the season. As in-form as he was toward the end, unfortunately for him you need to play well in more than just the last two months of the season to realistically make it to London…
Delpo after a good off season and recovery time should be ready to go next season. I think he will do some damage at AO next year. I also think that Dimi, Sasha and Goffin will also do well next year. I’m waiting to see how far Cilic can go here before saying how I see his early next season may turn out.
I doubt Djoko and co. can do much damage at AO as it’s still too early in the season. I even doubt Fedal could repeat what they had done at AO this season. Fed will be another year older and Dimi and Co more experienced, after this WTF when they’ll have some belief in themselves.
Rafa always has problems at AO; I feel his problem is that he tends to grind at AO. Contrast that to USO, it’s not difficult to see that Rafa tends to play more aggressive tennis there at the USO, hence he won three titles out of four finals.
I do feel it’s ingrained into Rafa that as he starts a season physically fresh, he tends to resort to grinding out matches, seeking to grind down opponents by outlasting them physically. As he progresses through the season, he will start feeling the physical strain and thus will then play more offensive tennis than normal.
Rafa was at his peak during AO2009, his best performance at the AO so far, didn’t need to grind until the SF. His next best was at AO2014, playing very well despite a palm blister to reach the final but was hampered by a back injury. Both times he was at no.1.
The rest of his AO events, he was grinding most of the times when facing the top ten opponents or red hot ones. I think if Rafa doesn’t make an effort to change this pattern of play, he may face another disappointment next AO, my opinion.
99% of fans would rather watch Rafa try than any lucky loser/alternate.
WTF is a showcase. That’s why they have alternates on standby as opposed to ANY. OTHER. ATP. TOURNAMENT.
Indoor tennis is a different sport IMO. Ball plays completely different.
Agree about the ball. On tv, it looks like every shot is loaded with extra spin. Not sure why that is.
Even though I’m sure you’re right about who fans would rather watch (me included), I thought the Nadal-Goffin match was very low quality. But I watched every point, something I’m sure wouldn’t have been true had PCB been playing.
Sorry Joe, you’re not the typical fan then.
Because I thought the match was low quality?
No.
Rafa made a joke of himself by coming over to London. Should have called the season in Paris.
Doesn’t matter, it’s not a joke for trying. He said it himself, he had missed it so many times that he didn’t want to miss this one. I respect his decision, and his will to win was really something to behold, even if he were to win this match, he said he would still withdraw, as couldn’t continue playing like this with the pain.
I don’t think it was a joke to Rafa to come and play in London. Nobody knows how he feels and what is in his mind and heart. He obviously wanted to try to play. He’s earned that by being #1 and finishing at the top.
It kind of galls me when anyone thinks they know more than the player.
I think it was important enough to Rafa to make the effort. He gave it his best and realized that he would not be able to continue to play. If that gives him some peace of mind, then that’s fine with me.
Rafa is very proud of having played the entire season: he detailed it. All 4 slams, all the masters. I guess he wanted to truly complete it by playing at the YEC. Also, Rafa does not truly know how well he will be able to play until he’s on court and in the match. He depends on the “narcotic” of competition to dull the pain. Sometimes it works, sometimes not.
Joke? He came to London and got the year end number one trophy. If that’s a joke, then my whole life is a joke.
no
means no
#HerbertWillWin