It came down to the last day of the regular season, but the stage is finally set for the 2017 World Tour Finals. Eight singles participants and eight doubles teams will take the court at the O2 Arena in London for an eight-day tennis extravaganza starting on Sunday.
The eight singles qualifiers are Rafael Nadal, Roger Federer, Alexander Zverev, Dominic Thiem, Marin Cilic, Grigor Dimitrov, David Goffin, and Jack Sock. Two places were there for the taking at last week’s Rolex Paris Masters, where Goffin and Sock clinched their London berths. Sock had to win the title in order to secure a spot in London, and that is exactly what he did.
“There have been a lot of firsts (for me in Paris),” Sock said after winning a Masters 1000 tournament for the first time in his career. “It started at the French Open with my first fourth round of a slam, now I’ve won my first Masters 1000 in Paris. This will be my first time in the top 10 and this will be the first time making the year-end finals.”
Sock and the rest of the field will find out their round-robin groups on Wednesday. As the No. 1 and No. 2 seeds, respectively, Nadal and Federer are sure to avoid each other at least until the semifinals.
The two groups will once again be named after past champions, a tradition established by The Finals Club–an initiative launched by the ATP in 2015. This year’s singles groups are named for Pete Sampras (Group A) and Boris Becker (Group B). Sampras won the year-end championship in 1991, 1994, 1996, 1997, and 1999. Becker was the winner in 1988, 1992, and 1995.
In doubles, Group A is named after Todd Woodbridge and Mark Woodforde, who won the event in 1992 and 1996. Group B is named after Jacco Eltingh and Paul Haarhuis, who captured titles in 1993 and 1998.
This year’s doubles lineup is as follows:
1) Marcelo Melo and Lukasz Kubot
2) Henri Kontinen and John Peers
3) Jean-Julien Roger and Horia Tecau
4) Jamie Murray and Bruno Soares
5) Bob Bryan and Mike Bryan
6) Pierre-Hugues Herbert and Nicolas Mahut
7) Ivan Dodig and Marcel Granollers
8) Ryan Harrison and Michael Venus
[polldaddy poll=9868045]
who ya got?
Nadal
haha
Olly, you would probably pick 2015 Rafa to beat 1995 Pete Sampras at Wimbledon, on the pre-2002 skating rink Centre Court. 😉
Just like Stanley would probably pick 2013 Federer to beat 2013 Rafa at Roland Garros. 😉
Love you Olly and Stanley!
I wouldn’t. But I’d pay good money to see those matches 🙂
Plzzz stop doing that.
Irrelevant question.
Anyway, Fedal may not win, who knows how’s their physical conditions. Rafa may not be as bad (physically) as many thought he is. The field at the WTF is weak, only a fit Fed is formidable. There’s no Djoko and there’s no Murray; so maybe a Rafa at 80% can still do the job if somebody takes care of Fed. Or, Fed a six time champion may win it again if he’s physically good enough to play five matches.
Sorry, I delete that ‘irrelevant question’ from my post above.
I dont think Nadal is playing. He should not play as well.
I’m a bit surprised he hasn’t pulled out already. His knee has now been hurting in 2 consecutive tournaments (at least), and there’s no reason to think he’ll be 100% in a few days time. If his level is near what it was in Paris, he probably won’t advance to the semi-finals, and may not win a match. So better to sit it out, heal and rest up, and come back strong in 2018.
Na don’t think Rafa’s playing
@Ricky,
Check you email please 🙂
Singles
1) Roger Federer or (2) Alexander Zverev to win WTF.
Doubles
1) Marcelo Melo and Lukasz Kubot or (2) Henri Kontinen and John Peers( Henri & John have lost momentum but I like them, their 1st match, especially their performance will tell me what to expect.
Ivan Dodig and Marcel Granollers are also playing well, really well.
If I had to pick just one-
1) Roger Federer, the king of tennis, #1, the best player this year.
1) Marcelo Melo and Lukasz Kubot, incredible guy’s, I underestimated them in the early stages of Paris not doing that again.
So the groups are out:
Group A:Nadal,Thiem,Dimitrov, Goffin
Group B:Federer,Zverev,Cilic,Sock
What do you think of them ?
Great! If Rafa is playing of course!
it is a good group for Rafa but I would be really surprised if he turns up.
I won’t be surprised that he will turn up to play. He may win one or two matches and may withdraw should he not feel good to continue. I doubt he really wants to miss playing WTF again.
Nadal may be number one but the year certainly belongs to Roger. Can anyone really beat Roger here? http://www.138mph.com/tennis-roger-federer-is-the-clear-favorite-to-win-the-atp-finals-in-london/
Yes it belongs to him( RF) and Rafa is PARTIALLY included.
It’s possible but I don’t think so.
Yeah, I agree with you guys. If Rafa turns up it’s an excellent draw for him, as he avoids the big servers（Cilic and Zverev）who are the biggest threats for him in this conditions. If he’s fit to play, he can absolutely take care of Thiem and Goffin there, with no major problems. The only guy that may give him a tough match is Grigor.
The year belongs to Fedal. Both have 2 slams; Fed may have 3 masters vs Rafa’s 2 and is 4-0 vs Rafa, but Rafa beats the rest of the field 67 times vs Fed’s 49.
Fed picks and chooses his battles but Rafa need not and ends the year as no. 1, I don’t think Fed has a better year than Rafa, and it’s ridiculous to say the year belongs to Fed.
The year belongs to R. Federer!
💪👏😉
Roger is THE best player in 2017, no one else.
😂🤣😎
Rafa is locked for the YE No. 1, that’s more than enough for this year. He has played too many matches already so it is alright if he will not play WTF and take the necessary rest for his nagging knee to recover.
See you folks next year at AO 2018.
Really don’t want Rafa to play. He should rest. He is the world no.1 and he has won 2 slams ! Funny how people are now using masters 1000 count to say Fed had a superior year lol. None of these fed fans ever mentioned masters 1000 when Rafa was leading the career total for masters 1000 by a decent margin.
Well VR, they’re always like that. Now, they talked about H2H when in the past they said it’s not important.
To me whoever finishes as no.1 has the best year; moreover, unlike the WTA, the ATP no.1 always ends up winning at least a slam. Rafa has two and wins the most points, I don’t see him having a year not as good as Fed’s.
Rafa also did better at the slams than Fed – 5380 (5200 if we take in three slams) vs Fed’s 4360. Even if Fed was to play at the FO, I doubt he would reach the final, so there’s no way Fed would be doing better than Rafa at the slams.
Seriously? If the Fed v Rafa head count was the only thing that mattered 2017 would be Fed’s first year at #1 since 2003!
@LS, good points!
@Ramara, LOL!
Yes, now both head to head and masters 1000 count have become so important all of a sudden. They have become so important that they’ve made fed the undisputed best player of 2017 lol.
To me both had incredible years. They defied the odds, shocked everyone and basically gave shut-up calls to many as well.
To be very fair, here are some of the NON-QUANTITATIVE factors that make Fedal’s 2017 so darn impressive:
Federer’s case:
–
The guy is playing his best tennis EVER at age 36. He is a much more complete player now and he has done this year is nothing short of miraculous. The guy had a surgery and came back to win his first tournament! Incredible ! How can he do it at this age?
Fed really won my admiration when he beat Rafa at the AO. I absolutely hated the moment but I could only admire that Fed produced his best tennis against an opponent who had absolutely owned him in grand slams, including the Australian Open. Even though Rafa I believe Rafa could have shifted to a higher gear (as he usually does in 5th sets) and he may have gotten tired, Fed was mighty impressive. He has tailored his game to overcome Rafa and it is hunger and desire for the game that let him do that. Winning 4 matches against Rafa is simply amazing.
Rafa’s case:
This guy mentally one of the toughest athlete EVER. It is unbelievable how he keeps defying the odds and comes back even stronger from injury lay offs. For the 100th time, majority wrote him off and he comes back this year playing arguably his best tennis ever on clay and the later stages of the USO. Is there anything that can break his willpower?? LOL at those who said he would never win a non-clay slam after his 2015 season.
I honestly thought myself that Rafa will not be competing at the highest level at 31. His tennis age is actually even more as he became a pro at age 15! The guy who was supposed to be done by 29, ends the year as world no.1!
The scary thing is that he is still pushing as hard as ever to improve all areas of his game.
What a legend Rafa Nadal is!
Love that comment, stopped reading after Federer’s case ended.
I will read Rafa’s case later but I really don’t want to 🤣😂🤣😂😄😅😁!
Nice comment Vamosrafa, you left out a lot on Fed’s case but I will take it.
Rafa was amazing this year, an incredible player, I can a write a book on his achievements but R.Federer was the best this year when u add everything together.
I hope Rafa plays WTF, looking forward to another FEDAL.
he was the best player to you but the world no.1 is Rafa Nadal. Both won 2 slams. Fed had a massive year due to reasons I mentioned and so did Rafa. To me sounds more fitting to say the world no.1 was the best but I am happy with the line ‘Fedal conquered 2017’.
No one is denying that Rafa is #1 but the better player, the one who outclassed everyone is Roger Federer, that’s not my opinion, the facts are accessible for all to see.
Most unbiased sports lover will agree that RF is the best player in tennis this year and…may be G. O. A. T( it’s debatable but let’s say he is one of the greatest to avoid arguments).
R. Federer is not even my #1 player in ATP, he is one my favorite, my top 2, I don’t have a #1 yet, when I make a player my #1 it hinder me in different ways, I will explain later not 2day.
VR, unlike you, I’ve never doubted that Rafa will come back and win some more slams. Before his 2017, I had predicted that Rafa would play till 2018, ie when he’s 32. Right now, I feel that Rafa can play till he’s 35, and playing mainly on clay and winning titles there. I’ve even foreseen that Rafa will overtake Fed in the slam counts, more so now after watching his 2017.
I’ve always believed that in addition to the FO where Rafa will continue to dominate, the USO is where Rafa will win some more slams, more so than AO and Wimbledon. I’m glad Rafa has proven that I’m right about the USO. In fact, Rafa has better results at the USO than the AO starting from 2008, getting to SF at least (with the exceptions of 2015/2016).
Rafa was unfortunate that he had to meet Dimi in the AO SF and having one less day rest than Fed before the final. At 30 Rafa needed more time to recover, than in 2009 when he’s 22. Imo, Rafa hadn’t gotten back to his previous high level on the HCs, whilst Fed was playing better than Rafa (on the HCs)all along from late 2014 through early 2016 before his knee injury.
Rafa seemed at a loss during IW/Miami, not playing well imo, whilst Fed played his best tennis at IW, and very determined tennis at Miami, credit to him. Shanghai was a quick surface so advantage Fed, and Rafa was already feeling the strain on his knee after playing for two consecutive weeks.
In fact I wasn’t surprised that Rafa lost to Fed on the HCs, as Fed was playing well on the HCs in the past few years losing only to Djoko, whilst Rafa was losing to many players on the HCs in the past few years.
Both Fed and Rafa had their ups and downs during 2017, but Rafa seemed to play very good offensive tennis at Beijing, too bad he had injured his knee, if not he might win at Paris. It’s still a very good year for Rafa even though he may not play at WTF.
never said I doubted Rafa would win more slams after his comeback. In fact, if you look at the posts of Rafa fans over the last few years, mine will stand out amongst the most positive.
What I meant to say was that when Rafa was young , I also had doubts he would be competing at the highest level at 31 given how frequently he was getting injured. So yeah, he has surprised me as well but that is not at all the same as saying i never had hope Rafa would be winning slams late.
In fact, on his comeback this year, I was actually pin-pointing the improvements he had made (esp on 2nd serve) and how I had hope he would have a very successful year.
VR, don’t bother to reason with Stanley, save your breath!
Fed had to avoid certain surface in order not to be beaten; also he was beaten by AZverev and Delpo,not to mention Donskoy and Haas, he’s certainly not unbeatable. It’s just that he’s more rested than the others, and only plays where he has better chances of winning. The more matches he plays, the more he’ll lose.
Lucky, what’s your problem?
Calm down! OK, chill!
It was just a discussion, don’t complicate things.
Please relax!
Fed might not have won Wimbledon perhaps if he had played a full clay season. He had so much time to prepare for grass. When he arrived at Wimbledon, he said he is tired of practising and just wants to take to the court now!
What’s up with you guys that it’s so hard to recognize that Rafa is the deserved YE ＃1 ?
Do you really believe that if Fed played the clay season,he still would have all the success he had this year ?
The only way I would give Federer the YE ＃1 would be if Rafa hadn’t been so consistent all over the season, which is not the case.
Possibly, I can say it was Federer who played the highest level of tennis between both of them, but even that is debatable, given that Rafa also produced some absolutely masterclass tennis during the clay season, especially at the FO.
^good points
Gaviria says AT 1:11 PM: “What’s up with you guys that it’s so hard to recognize that Rafa is the deserved YE ＃1 ?”
===
Fedfans have hated Rafa since he started to beat their beloved one (in 2004)! LOL
Unfortunately there is a tremendously blind Fedfan here, but we also have very nice Fedfans here in the Grandstand, who can see beyond their idol and with pretty much knowledge regarding tennis.
True Gaviria. But Augusta doesn’t use to notice that Fedfan group you are mentioning.
From all posts I read from Augusta, a Fedfan is someone who hates Rafa. Nonsense. The worst thing is to assume that all people supporting a player, have the same views about their opponent.
Augusta’s whole Grandstand existence is strictly trash-talking anyone who even remotely likes Federer, and trying to create tension between the two Fedal factions where there is none. I have never seen her say one single word about tennis. Ever. Just mean-spirited, trolling posts about Roger Federer and anyone who likes him. Don’t let her sweet pre-Rafa-match words of encouragement ritual fool you…. You ever see the awful, mean-spirited anti-Rafa trolls on Tennis-X? Augusta is the precise, splitting image of them, except anti-Federer rather than anti-Rafa. She is exactly who she claims to hate. And it’s sad…
I just want everyone to be happy,no matter which player you support. However, I couldn’t hate Federer even if I wanted to, he’s such a great guy on and off the court.
＃FEDALUNITED
It’s so nice to hear Fedal fans say positive things like that, Gaviria. 🙂 There’s been a lot of it this season given how great they’ve both been. I honestly think that the whole Laver Cup thing was really great for the fans of both guys. When I watched the matches on YouTube, especially the Fedal doubles match, I loved seeing all the comments below that said things like, “I’m a huge Federer fan, but nothing but love for Nadal! #FedalUnited”. Or “I’ve always loved Rafa, but much respect to Fed! #FedalUnited” As someone who has always been very frustrated and disenchanted by the tension and insecurity that some fans of Fedal, and Novak, have had toward each other, that Laver Cup weekend was really fun for me to watch. 🙂 I’m a person who is of the opinion that Fedal and Novak are equally the three greatest men’s players of all-time, and that it is actually a disservice to their legacies, and to the game of tennis, to try to claim that one of them could be considered “greater” than the other two. They have each achieved so much, and are so uniquely great for their own reasons that it just seems so pointless and impossible to try to definitively determine that one of them is “better” than the other two. I’ve subjected the poor souls on this site to my rants on this subject too many times to count, so I won’t go into any more detail on my feelings about it…. Glad to have you here, though, Gaviria. 🙂
What a spiteful speech from a Fedfan about me AT 11:12 PM! LOL
And look at all the people coming to your defense, Augusta, disputing what I said! 🙂
I really aprecciate your words Kevin 😊
Since I started watching tennis I have to admit that I was an anti-Djokovic fan, mainly because off his behaviour, either in court（everything is great when winning but when he’s losing even the ballboys have to take his frustration, not even gonna mention the way he treated some crowds）or outside of it（the tings he said about Fedal really pissed me out).
For me, he will never be an ATG at the level of Fedal, based on his attitude.
However, speaking only in terms of tennis produced, I would rank him tied with Sampras, just a little below to Fedal. If he can comeback like Fedal done this year, then I could rank him alongside them.
What’s interesting is that right now, I don’t hate Novak anymore. I still dislike him, but have to say that I’m missing him on the Tour right now, as he brings competitiveness and he’s able to display a really high level of tennis when at his best.
Hope you understand my point of view Kevin.
never quite approve the use of the term ‘Fedfans’. there are some really nice fed fans on tenngrand. Some can be annoying just like some of the Rafa fans can be but I think tenngrand now has a high number of reasonable posters.
Nah, Djoko is always gracious in defeats but his celebration after his wins can be rather ungracious.
I don’t dislike Djoko, though I couldn’t stand him and his celebrations during his seven straight wins over Rafa in 2011. I think the big four are nice guys, they’re doing their part to help promote tennis and also to promote charitable works.
If Djoko could get close to Fedal’s slam counts and other achievements, I don’t see him as ‘inferior’ to Fedal’s ATG status; he would’ve earned his ATG status in his own rights. In fact I feel Djoko is the only guy who’s great on all surfaces, something Fedal couldn’t do, as they both have their ‘weakest’ surface that they couldn’t conquer ( esp vs their greatest rival).
Djoko is also gaining popularity worldwide even though he won’t be as popular as Fed, and to a certain extent, as Rafa. He has more sponsorship money than Rafa and only Fed is ahead of him (well way ahead).
Can’t agree with you saying Novak is ALWAYS gracious in defeat, for sure he has improved his behaviour as he aged but still sometimes he can´t behave at the same level as the tennis player he his. He already earned his ATG status, the only question which remains unanswered is where will he be ranked in the ATG list when his career is over.
Nadal will be fit for London, says coach Moya
http://www.eurosport.com/tennis/nadal-will-be-fit-for-london-says-coach-moya_sto6403473/story.shtml
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Was just going to post same thing. You beat me to it..lol
https://twitter.com/sittanyusha/status/928300604472090624
That is very disingenuous by Moya. It’s just not true that Rafa only pulled out of Paris to minimize risks. His form was sub-par in Paris and he was clearly hurting even in the Shanghai final. The injury almost certainly predates that match, given that he arrived with the knee bandaged.
There is absolutely no reason to think the knee has healed, and lots of reason to think it will be reinjured or aggravated. Maybe Nadal and his team honestly think he can still win WTF. Hard to believe, but I can’t see any other good reason to play it.
I think he is just saying he will play n won’t withdraw. I frankly have no expectations. A semi result will be considered a success I think .
So then Rafa is going to play in London? I was thinking that he might skip it and rest the knee. He looked good in practice, but actual matches are a different thing altogether.
I hope that if he does play that it goes well for him.
Oh and for me, Rafa being #1 again with all that he has accomplished, means that he was the best player this year. Both Rafa and Fed has great years, but Rafa played in every slam and got the #1 ranking again. That is a great achievement for a player who was written off by too many.
Vamos Rafa!
Oh and for me, Roger Federer defeating Rafa so many times this year, in many finals with all that he has accomplished, all the trophies etc means that he is the best player this year.
Vamos Stanley!
Where did Vamos Stanley come from?
Lol!
I think Rafa’s knees are overstressed. He has some treatment. He will play and might withdraw if he feels pain. I still think had Paris Masters been a major, he would have played.
He had a rest for 4 weeks. So he should be able to play 1 full tourney.
Nadal is the YE #1 and deservedly so. The only way I would say that Federer had a better year is if Rafa doesn’t play WTF and Fed wins the tournament and all five matches. That would leave him a mere 140 points behind Rafa, with two more titles, both “big” ones, including WTF, plus the winning H2H. In my opinion, that would give Federer the better year, by a narrow margin.
In any case, it looks like Rafa is going to play WTF, at least a couple matches. He has the benefit of the easier group, but I still think it’s an unwise decision to play.
Anyone who claims that Federer has had a better season than Rafa STRICTLY because he went 4-0 against Rafa doesn’t understand how tennis works… A head-to-head shows one thing- that you were really good at beating that one player. It has no other meaning aside from that.
That being said, that doesn’t mean that head-to-head means nothing. It is still a factor to be taken into account with these sort of debates. It is perfectly reasonable for people to use Fed’s 4-0 head to head in 2017 over Rafa as just one factor in arguing that Fed had a better 2017, or at very least serve as a tiebreaker in the case that someone feels their seasons were equally great. Particularly since all 4 of those wins came en route to 4 different big titles. We can’t pretend like that doesn’t mean anything… Just like most people can’t ignore the importance of Rafa’s overall head-to-head lead against Federer when discussing why Fed is not the undisputed “greatest”.
For me personally, I cannot make a final decision as to who I believe had a better season overall until the WTF is over. If Rafa were to win WTF, especially if he beat Fed on the way, that would significantly change the way I currently view their seasons.
I don’t have any qualms with the argument that Rafa had the better season because he ended #1- that is a perfectly sound argument! However, I also think it’s a perfectly sound argument to think that Federer had the better season. AT THIS MOMENT, it’s easy for me to see why some people, including Ricky, would think that Federer has the slight edge for a few reasons, before even bringing the 4-0 2017 h2h into my thought process. For one thing, Federer has won one more big title than Rafa thus far. He has also won big titles in what I consider to be three distinct sections of the season- the first quarter of the season, Grass swing, and the post-US Open hardcourt swing. I understand the argument that he may not have been able to have the success he had this season if he hadn’t skipped a lot. But at the same time, most players would not be able to take breaks like that and then come back and dominate dominate again as if they never left. Federer only played 4 Masters events this season… and he won 3 of them and made the final of the other. He only played 3 majors this season, and he won two of them. I don’t care how many tournaments he missed- at age 36, the fact that he has been able to win the overwhelming majority of the Big tournaments he has played is astounding.
So now, while Fed has won more big titles spread out more throughout the season, I will also factor in the fact that Rafa did accumulate more more points than Federer, and did end the season #1. In my mind, that could make their seasons they have had thus far just about equal. That’s where the 2017 head-to-head factor just cannot be ignored in my mind. We’re talking strictly this season, not their overall head to head. If we’re talking about 2017, where they arguably had equally great seasons on their own rights, I think it makes sense for people to view Federer’s favorable head-to-head as the deciding factor for 2017. Even if Fed had played RG and a warm-up event on clay, and lost to Rafa in both, it would still be a favorable head to head to Federer.
Ultimately, in situations like this, 99% of diehard Rafans are going to argue that Rafa had the better season, and 99% of diehard Fedfans will argue for Federer. It’s just the reality of it. For me, personally, the WTF could very well decide who I feel had a better season. At the same time, I wonder why it even matters when they both were so great for very different reasons. Why am I even entertaining it? I can’t stand the ridiculous “GOAT” conversation, so why am I giving attention to the 2017 season debate? I guess maybe I feel like with a single-season debate, there is so many less variables involved, and it’s a smaller sample size, it doesn’t feel remotely as unreasonable to try to come to a conclusion as opposed to the insanely broad, endlessly-subjective question of who “is greater”.
I dragged on much longer than originally intended, but the key point I was trying to get across is that suggesting that a favorable season head to head automatically equals a better season is categorically false. And at the same time, it can’t just be completely ignored. Same goes for overall head to heads. It’s just one facet of debating two players, but it is a facet nonetheless…
It’s much easier to say Fedal dominated totally 2017 as someone mentioned before. Just because there are so many debates about who’s had a better season, shows that they both were great and again there is little to separate them.
A greater question than who had a better 2017 season is who has more chances to go deeper or win AO? Including the rest of the guys.
To each his own, everyone is free to think his/her fave player is having his best season, more than the other players. There’s no point in arguing, I believe most of us have already said our piece and we’re not going to convince others who don’t agree with our views. We just have to agree to disagree.
Kevin, Rafa won the big titles on clay and he won the USO (HC). If you’re going to divide the season this way, Fed would have the adv as most events were played on the HCs and Fed avoided clay.
Just imagine Rafa skipped Shanghai and played and won Paris, that would make him same as Fed, ie with three Masters titles and having same no. of titles post USO. And, he would then have one fewer loss to Fed. If Fed played more Masters event, I doubt he’s winning many more of them; he might suffer more losses than just one.
Yes, if Rafa had won Paris, then the same could be said about him. But he didn’t win Paris, as he wasn’t even there. But that’s why if he wins WTF it would likely significantly change the way I view his season. I’m not questioning why you think Rafa has had a better season, Lucky. I’m just giving reasons why some people might think otherwise.
And I think that, assuming his knee holds up, Rafa has a much better shot at WTF than people are giving him credit for. Especially now that’s we’ve seen the groups. Rafa should have no issue advances past his RR group. By the time he faces Fed, whether in the semis or the final if they both make it that far, Fed could be potentially much more worn out from having to face both Zverev and Cilic in RR. Sure, Fed would be favored in both those match-ups, but we all know that Zverev and Cilic are capable of beating Federer on their day, or at least pushing him really far… I’m not going as far as to predict that Rafa is going to win WTF, but I also never would have predicted that he would have won the US Open. If the surface turns out to be slower, and his knee holds up, I certainly wouldn’t write him off there…
Huh? Rafa was there at Paris Masters, he withdrew after reaching QF, because of his knee issue. I’m just saying, that should Rafa stop playing after winning Beijing, rest for four weeks and played Paris Masters, he might even win at Paris and would have the same number of titles as Fed and one less loss. All these are just assumptions, what if scenarios.
Rafa deserves the number one ranking. He played a ful season, won two slams, won some masters as well, and accumulated the most points. And if Roger had played the clay court season, he may not have been able to win Wimbledon so it only makes sense to give Rafa the credit he deserves. He is the deserving word number one but both had phenomenal seasons with Roger just winning the particular matchup but not the year as a whole.
Yep. When you go to the rankings page on the ATP website, “Rafael Nadal” is the first name at the top. That’s why I can’t tell someone they’re wrong if they think he had the better season. We can all have differing views on what a “better season” means, but it is just a fact that Rafa is the “top dog” right now. And he just may stay the top dog for the foreseeable future. Cuz let’s face it- I can’t imagine Federer playing the clay season again anytime soon, and if he couldn’t get to #1 after winning AO, IW, Miami, Halle, and Wimby, Shanghai, and Basel, then it’s probably not ever going to happen again for him…. If there was ever a good example of why guys in their mid-to-late thirties just don’t get to #1, it’s probably Federer 2017.
Federer getting to no 1 depends as much on how he plays as it does on rafa and rest of the tour next year
I feel ending the year as no 1 is way higher than just getting to no 1 in the middle of the year and then losing it. It’s surprising that top 3 have 5 , 4, 4 years ended as no 1 which shows how close is it. Now take number of weeks into consideration and its different story all together with Fed almost 130 weeks more than rafa and even Novak some 60 weeks more. Rafas injuries of course played spoilsport both times in 2009 and 2014 which reduces his count majorly.
Rafa’s always felt that way too. The tennis year is a sport season and ending it as #1 means you “won” the season. Otoh, because tennis ranking points are good for a full 365 days, any time a player gets to #1 he’s had the best year of anyone and is certainly entitled to bragging rights. Rather different from baseball or football where the standings get wiped at the end of the season and you start over equal with each new season.
There are so many debates but finally it will be all forgotten. All that will go on record books and history is rafa ended year as no 1 and they both won 2 slams each. Maybe rafas 3 decimas all converging in the same year will be surely remembered as it is unique and stellar . Nobody will bother or remember few years down the line who won the non slams or masters this year. These debates are good for fun and have their expiry date as people will find a better topic and current topic to debate on 🙂
Simple, Fed after winning seven big titles still couldn’t get to no.1 because:
1) he didn’t play a full season;
2) there’s someone who did play a full season and winning six big titles, just one short of his;
3) that someone did better than him at the slams and that’s a good chunk of point difference;
4) not forgetting Fed won three masters and reached one final; that someone won two and reached two finals, not exactly far behind;
5) that someone played consistently well throughout the season and collected more points than him when other players playing a full season couldn’t do the same.
The one who could play a full season and played well in most certainly had a good season. It’s just like in 2012, when the big four each won a slam, and Djoko was no.1 because he won more points than the others, despite him losing to Rafa three times that year, and despite both he and Fed each winning a slam and three masters.
Never understood how djoko has more sponsorship money than Rafa. I think it’s quality over quantity. Maybe rafa endorses few and select brands whereas Novak endorses more in number. It’s more important to see how much each gets paid to endorse a brand and not total sponsorship money as the number of brands can skew it. I think rafa does not endorse much right apart from kia ,tommy, Nike etc.
Novak Djokovic is one of my favorites.
Amazing guy! Just…. He has his own problems, but a good guy.
Talk later, kinda of busy.
Djoko attracts very good brands and it’s quality over quantity for him – ANZ bank, Peugeot, Lacoste, Heads rackets, watch (I think it’s Seiko) – the main ones. According to some reports, he gets paid $34m for those endorsements.
Rafa’s $32m (according to the same reports) – Nike, Babulot, Kia, Richard Mille, Banc Sabadell, Maphre insurance, one Spanish Telecom co., some Spanish food and also nutritional supplements co. etc. I think Rafa endorses mainly Spanish brands.
Of course the king of endorsements is non other than Fed. He attracted $58m! – Rolex, Nike, Mercedes, Wilson, Lindt, Moët and Chandon, Credit Suisse, Swiss Reinsurance, one Swiss coffee maker co., one private jet co, and one recently added pasta co. The pasta co. paid him $40m for five years, my goodness, Fed selling pasta and gets paid $8m a year! I didn’t know selling pasta can be so profitable – for the manufacturer and the endorser.
may be Rafa’s inferior English speaking skills have something to do with it?
Luckystar, AT 1:38 PM
You can see endorsements from June 1, 2016 to June 1, 2017 here:
https://www.forbes.com/athletes/list/#tab:overall
Luckystar AT 1:38 PM,
Maybe the Forbes’s data don’t include all the ‘endorsements’ Rafa receives. Sponsors support him via his business and other activities.
For example:
– Kia supports Rafa’s foundation, his academy, the Rafa Nadal Tour (children’s tennis circuit in Spain):
https://press.kia.com/eu/en/home/media-resouces/press-releases/2017/Stinger_Rafa_Nadal.html
– Dekton (a brand of Cosentino, a manufacturer of architectural surfaces) is one of the main sponsors of Rafa’s academy. Architectural materials developed&manufactured by Cosentino have been used for various facilities of Rafa’s academy and his restaurants TATEL & ZELA in Madrid, Miami and Ibiza.
Cosentino is a global, Spanish, family-owned company.
https://www.cosentino.com/blog/no-1-tennis-champion-rafael-nadal-presents-dekton-by-cosentino-industrial-series-in-london/
I think there’s also an airline deal that sponsors air travels done by his academy.
Luckystar AT 4:45 PM;
That airline is Air Europa.
And “Technogym is a proud Partner of the Rafa Nadal Academy by Movistar” 🙂
https://www.technogym.com/int/news-events-blog/technogym-is-a-proud-partner-of-the-rafa-nadal-academy-by-movistar/
Rafa does Hilfiger and Armani too, Bacardi is another, he has many endorsements of his own, his endorsements are absolutely fine, and nothing to feel ashamed or embarrased about ….
Also on tour hes the second most promoted star, and the biggest name after Federer ….
I think there’re a few reasons.
Fed has a head start over Rafa and Djoko, and most people are taken in by Fed’s beautiful game. The media at that time (as early as 2004) had already earmarked Fed as one for the ATG in future (I got that message while I watched Fedal Miami 2004 and the commentators back then were already talking up Fed, when Fed had won only two slams at that time! They thought Rafa would be soundly beaten in that match, but Rafa shown them he was also an ATG in the making! I was smiling to myself, thinking how wrong those commentators were, when they could never predict how the Fedal rival would turn out in future.
Rafa had his injury issues and each time when he’s at the top of the rankings, he suffered from injury and lost his top ranking, taking breaks to recover. I guess sponsors or potential ones had questions over Rafa’s longevity in the sports and that might be a deterrent.
Rafa’s grasp of the English language in the past might be another factor. Djoko, like Fed, speaks good English and Djoko’s long reign at no.1 and he rarely gets injured may have helped him in clinching those lucrative sponsorships.